From fmadre at free.fr  Wed Nov  4 13:48:31 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2009 13:48:31 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] [syndicate spectre] welcome to the new admins!
In-Reply-To: <4AF17699.3070808@free.Fr>
Message-ID: <1663535527.1390021257338910958.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

> Yeah, ok, [troll]give us the admin password too.[/troll]

you don't have it ?

>  What the heck is that "spectre " suffix in list name?

power to the people!
this is NOT syndicate

f.
----- Mail Original -----
De: "S/U/N" <s.u.n at free.Fr>
?: syndicate at tekspost.no
Envoy?: Mercredi 4 Novembre 2009 13h42:01 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: Re: [syndicate spectre] welcome to the new admins!



************************  Cluster #[[   fm   ]] possibly emitted, @Time
[[   04/11/2009 11:15   ]] The Following #String  **********************
> [syndicate spectre] list run by subterfluent at gmail.com, fmadre at free.fr, [..]
> _______________________________________________
> syndicate mailing list
> syndicate at tekspost.no
> http://tekspost.no/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
> hosted by http://teks.no
>
>
>   


_______________________________________________
syndicate mailing list
syndicate at tekspost.no
http://tekspost.no/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
hosted by http://teks.no

From fmadre at free.fr  Wed Nov  4 16:16:33 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2009 16:16:33 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] [syndicate spectre] syndicate post from
 edviubkiif@mail15.com requires approval
In-Reply-To: <4AF18228.5060604@various-euro.com>
Message-ID: <1521992786.1420571257347793954.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

> what is happening with your list?

this one (tekspost) is dead
stillborn

> Everybody is an admin now?
> http://tekspost.no/mailman/admindb/syndicate

oui

> and see the mail below...?

hey, being an admin has its drawbacks
it's not only parading around the city centre with your tricolor flag across your chest


> best wishes

you too, dear fellow admin

> ve





syndicate-owner at tekspost.no schrieb:
> As list administrator, your authorization is requested for the
> following mailing list posting:
> 
>     List:    syndicate at tekspost.no
>     From:    edviubkiif at mail15.com
>     Subject: Bli en spiller, bli en vinner
>     Reason:  Post by non-member to a members-only list
> 
> At your convenience, visit:
> 
>     http://tekspost.no/mailman/admindb/syndicate
>         
> to approve or deny the request.
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Betreff:
> Bli en spiller, bli en vinner
> Von:
> "Your Gaming Palace" <edviubkiif at mail15.com>
> Datum:
> Wed, 04 Nov 2009 20:12:26 +0700
> An:
> <syndicate at anart.no>
> 
> An:
> <syndicate at anart.no>
> CC:
> <information-request at anart.no>, <marius at anart.no>, <wahl at anart.no>
> 
> Received:
> from mailnull by eglin.copyleft.no with mongodone (Exim 4.61 (FreeBSD))
> (envelope-from <edviubkiif at mail15.com>) id 1N5eyw-000BgS-Mg for
> syndicate at tekspost.no; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:58 +0100
> Received:
> from mail10.copyleft.no ([195.159.105.140]) by eglin.copyleft.no with
> esmtp (Exim 4.61 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from <edviubkiif at mail15.com>) id
> 1N5eyw-000BgP-Lg for syndicate at tekspost.no; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:58 +0100
> Received:
> from mail9.copyleft.no ([82.117.37.109]) by mail10.copyleft.no with
> esmtp (Exim 4.66 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from <edviubkiif at mail15.com>) id
> 1N5eyw-0007ZC-Jk for syndicate at tekspost.no; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:58 +0100
> Received:
> from mailnull by mail9.copyleft.no with spam (Exim 4.60 (FreeBSD))
> (envelope-from <edviubkiif at mail15.com>) id 1N5eyw-0001Nr-HD for
> syndicate at anart.no; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:58 +0100
> Received:
> from 92.127.112-72.xdsl.ab.ru ([92.127.112.72] helo=mail15.com) by
> mail9.copyleft.no with smtp (Exim 4.60 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from
> <edviubkiif at mail15.com>) id 1N5eyu-00018g-9f; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:58
> +0100
> Nachricht-ID:
> <48283777.64262786 at anart.no>
> MIME-Version:
> 1.0
> Content-Type:
> text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
> Content-Transfer-Encoding:
> quoted-printable
> X-Criteria:
> ViaPrimary
> X-Criteria:
> HeloDoesntMatch
> X-Bogocaught-Centralized-famine:
> Unsure
> X-Mongofilterz:
> true
> X-Bogocaught-Centralized-eglin:
> Unsure
> 
> 
> Erfarne kasinospillere vet at Euro Gaming Palace er stedet for det beste: super rulett, treffende craps, livlig videopokerspill, adrenalinpumpende blackjack og mye mer h?yspenning.
> 
> Hvis du ogs? tar kasinospillet ditt p? alvor, m? du pr?ve lykken med blackjack, baccarat eller et av de massive jackpotspillene v?re. 
> 
> For ? gi deg en god start har vi en velkomstbonus p? 300 dollar - $300 - som bare venter p? deg! 
> 
> http://www.gamingeurosuccess.net/no/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Betreff:
> confirm 858b50818a391828b5cfe0ba83fe74a1a903897d
> Von:
> syndicate-request at tekspost.no
> Datum:
> Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:59 +0100
> 
> Content-Type:
> text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version:
> 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding:
> quoted-printable
> Absender:
> syndicate-request at tekspost.no
> Nachricht-ID:
> <mailman.1077.1257337739.1377.syndicate at tekspost.no>
> 
> 
> If you reply to this message, keeping the Subject: header intact,
> Mailman will discard the held message.  Do this if the message is
> spam.  If you reply to this message and include an Approved: header
> with the list password in it, the message will be approved for posting
> to the list.  The Approved: header can also appear in the first line
> of the body of the reply.

_______________________________________________
syndicate mailing list
syndicate at tekspost.no
http://tekspost.no/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
hosted by http://teks.no

From fmadre at free.fr  Wed Nov  4 16:19:15 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2009 16:19:15 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] [syndicate spectre] syndicate post from
 edviubkiif@mail15.com requires approval
In-Reply-To: <92461347.1420901257347886791.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
Message-ID: <1541177262.1421141257347955149.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

so, admins: shall we approve this mail from edviubkiif at mail15.com ?
or reject ?
difficult decision
send your arguments to the REAL list
Syndicate at ck13.org


----- Mail Original -----
De: "Mindaugas Gapsevicius" <mi_ga at o-o.lt>
?: syndicate at tekspost.no
Envoy?: Mercredi 4 Novembre 2009 14h47:24 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: Re: [syndicate spectre] syndicate post from edviubkiif at mail15.com requires approval

nice, i am in the list. Love to be an admin again

various euro wrote:
> hi syndicates,
> 
> what is happening with your list?
> 
> Everybody is an admin now?
> http://tekspost.no/mailman/admindb/syndicate
> 
> and see the mail below...?
> 
> 
> best wishes
> 
> ve
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> syndicate-owner at tekspost.no schrieb:
>> As list administrator, your authorization is requested for the
>> following mailing list posting:
>>
>>     List:    syndicate at tekspost.no
>>     From:    edviubkiif at mail15.com
>>     Subject: Bli en spiller, bli en vinner
>>     Reason:  Post by non-member to a members-only list
>>
>> At your convenience, visit:
>>
>>     http://tekspost.no/mailman/admindb/syndicate
>>         
>> to approve or deny the request.
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Betreff:
>> Bli en spiller, bli en vinner
>> Von:
>> "Your Gaming Palace" <edviubkiif at mail15.com>
>> Datum:
>> Wed, 04 Nov 2009 20:12:26 +0700
>> An:
>> <syndicate at anart.no>
>>
>> An:
>> <syndicate at anart.no>
>> CC:
>> <information-request at anart.no>, <marius at anart.no>, <wahl at anart.no>
>>
>> Received:
>> from mailnull by eglin.copyleft.no with mongodone (Exim 4.61 (FreeBSD))
>> (envelope-from <edviubkiif at mail15.com>) id 1N5eyw-000BgS-Mg for
>> syndicate at tekspost.no; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:58 +0100
>> Received:
>> from mail10.copyleft.no ([195.159.105.140]) by eglin.copyleft.no with
>> esmtp (Exim 4.61 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from <edviubkiif at mail15.com>) id
>> 1N5eyw-000BgP-Lg for syndicate at tekspost.no; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:58 +0100
>> Received:
>> from mail9.copyleft.no ([82.117.37.109]) by mail10.copyleft.no with
>> esmtp (Exim 4.66 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from <edviubkiif at mail15.com>) id
>> 1N5eyw-0007ZC-Jk for syndicate at tekspost.no; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:58 +0100
>> Received:
>> from mailnull by mail9.copyleft.no with spam (Exim 4.60 (FreeBSD))
>> (envelope-from <edviubkiif at mail15.com>) id 1N5eyw-0001Nr-HD for
>> syndicate at anart.no; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:58 +0100
>> Received:
>> from 92.127.112-72.xdsl.ab.ru ([92.127.112.72] helo=mail15.com) by
>> mail9.copyleft.no with smtp (Exim 4.60 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from
>> <edviubkiif at mail15.com>) id 1N5eyu-00018g-9f; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:58
>> +0100
>> Nachricht-ID:
>> <48283777.64262786 at anart.no>
>> MIME-Version:
>> 1.0
>> Content-Type:
>> text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>> Content-Transfer-Encoding:
>> quoted-printable
>> X-Criteria:
>> ViaPrimary
>> X-Criteria:
>> HeloDoesntMatch
>> X-Bogocaught-Centralized-famine:
>> Unsure
>> X-Mongofilterz:
>> true
>> X-Bogocaught-Centralized-eglin:
>> Unsure
>>
>>
>> Erfarne kasinospillere vet at Euro Gaming Palace er stedet for det beste: super rulett, treffende craps, livlig videopokerspill, adrenalinpumpende blackjack og mye mer h?yspenning.
>>
>> Hvis du ogs? tar kasinospillet ditt p? alvor, m? du pr?ve lykken med blackjack, baccarat eller et av de massive jackpotspillene v?re. 
>>
>> For ? gi deg en god start har vi en velkomstbonus p? 300 dollar - $300 - som bare venter p? deg! 
>>
>> http://www.gamingeurosuccess.net/no/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Betreff:
>> confirm 858b50818a391828b5cfe0ba83fe74a1a903897d
>> Von:
>> syndicate-request at tekspost.no
>> Datum:
>> Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:59 +0100
>>
>> Content-Type:
>> text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> MIME-Version:
>> 1.0
>> Content-Transfer-Encoding:
>> quoted-printable
>> Absender:
>> syndicate-request at tekspost.no
>> Nachricht-ID:
>> <mailman.1077.1257337739.1377.syndicate at tekspost.no>
>>
>>
>> If you reply to this message, keeping the Subject: header intact,
>> Mailman will discard the held message.  Do this if the message is
>> spam.  If you reply to this message and include an Approved: header
>> with the list password in it, the message will be approved for posting
>> to the list.  The Approved: header can also appear in the first line
>> of the body of the reply.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> syndicate mailing list
> syndicate at tekspost.no
> http://tekspost.no/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
> hosted by http://teks.no
> 
> 

_______________________________________________
syndicate mailing list
syndicate at tekspost.no
http://tekspost.no/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
hosted by http://teks.no

From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 00:19:39 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fr)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 00:19:39 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] admins update
Message-ID: <4AF20C0B.2050209@free.fr>

hello dear admins,
one admin left the coveted position
of admin
here's the new list of admins
just in case

f.

[syndicate <http://tekspost.no/mailman/listinfo/syndicate> spectre] list 
run by subterfluent at gmail.com, fmadre at free.fr, a8504902 at 
unet.univie.ac.at, a8theist at yahoo.co.uk, a at 3kta.net, aart at 
eunet.yu, acido at libero.it, acido at wooow.it, adamo at units.it, 
addfield at ath.forthnet.gr, agenbite at uchicago.edu, ajaco at 
xs4all.nl, alas at ath.forthnet.gr, alasdigi at otenet.gr, 
alexandre.gurita at biennaledeparis.org, alternative at dksg.co.yu, 
alvinj at bigfoot.com, an at eroticunion.org, anders at elberling.com, 
andraz.kusej at guest.arnes.si, andre at arsonore.net, andrew.murphie at 
gmail.com, andrew at futurephysical.org, anne at sakasama.net, 
anneliis.beadnell at gmail.com, annemarieskriver at yahoo.com, arcangel 
at unosunosyunosceros.com, art_media_x at yahoo.fr, ash at press.bg, 
atobu at osk.3web.ne.jp, autonomy at ss.iij4u.or.jp, 
autumnfoliage222+syndicate at gmail.com, awards2008 at vjawards.com, 
azul_onirico at hotmail.com, b-l-u-e-s-c-r-e-e-n at 
b-l-u-e-s-c-r-e-e-n.net, barcelone at fastmail.fm, bardomatic10031 at 
yahoo.com, be at 5uper.net, beate at zurwehme.org, bendji at magnet.ch, 
benjamin at cultura3.net, birdbox at uk2.net, bljace at scca.org.mk, 
bobig at fake-artist.net, borowski at zkm.de, br.gess at gmail.com, 
brainstorm at i-love-u.ch, brizzi at dada.it, bulent at bulentbas.com, 
bytetime at gmail.com, c.lucille at gmail.com, c at klingt.org, cahen.x 
at levels9.com, camille.pb at gmail.com, carolethibaud at yahoo.fr, 
cathsign at gmail.com, cduneau at yahoo.com, cecilebabiole at 
wanadoo.fr, celix_the_fat at hotmail.com, charles.baldwin at 
mail.wvu.edu, choubard at gmail.com, cippitel at gmail.com, cl3mos at 
gmail.com, clk267 at nyu.edu, cntrntr at gmail.com, contact at 
kamchatka.fr, contact at sound-delta.eu, cotoroaba at yahoo.com, 
counterwork at blueyonder.co.uk, crunteanularisa at yahoo.com, csm at 
eunet.yu, ctgr at free.fr, daniela at daniela-reimann.de, daswa at 
xs4all.nl, daucikan at yahoo.com, david.glas at balie.nl, david_cho at 
sympatico.ca, ddanata at yahoo.com, dejansr at yubc.net, diakminas at 
yahoo.com, dissemination.jbnaudy at gmail.com, dk at 
telekommunisten.net, domino at fieldform.com, donation at 
societerealiste.net, dragneva at mail.md, dragonns at eunet.yu, drekdede 
at hotpop.com, drog.frog at mail.ee, drone at digitalbiotope.com, dumb 
at tcpa-info.org, dumke at body-bytes.de, e.m.a.i.l at free.fr, e at 
various-euro.com, ear at pingwin.icm.edu.pl, earwig1 at mindspring.com, 
ed at pips.at, eda at mail.ljudmila.org, eddy.deruwe at skynet.be, 
ediqnk at albaniaonline.net, eivindro at animod.no, elektro80 at 
macpoint.no, email at ctrlaltdel.org, epistolaris at freemail.hu, 
ericmailinglist at gmail.com, erinyes89 at yahoo.com, eryk at 
maine.rr.com, espen at gangvik.no, espen at teks.no, estella at 
beotel.yu, eth1394 at blutgift.de, eugaznog at gmail.com, eva.artinger 
at web.de, extraflash at gmail.com, fendertrack at yahoo.com, fi at 
theenormousspace.com, filmfestival at film-sharing.net, flahertyniall at 
eircom.net, fmadre at free.fr, francesco.dorazio at uniroma1.it, fwcc01 
at yahoo.com.hk, gerfried at aec.at, gianluca.tulelli at gmail.com, gif 
at 220hex.org, giginmomo at hotmail.com, gitane.6373809 at 
bloglines.com, gshreeve at ifslearning.com, guibertc at 
criticalsecret.com, guilherme.fonseca at itaucultural.org.br, hannesario 
at web.de, hecspc at goto20.com, hedley at hedleyroberts.co.uk, 
heitjohann at gmail.com, helene_rendtel at yahoo.com, heleneprevost at 
videotron.ca, herwig at khm.de, higgs at bananamum.com, hight at 
34n118w.net, horrorkatze at modukit.com, hrvoje.hirsl at gmail.com, 
i-haus at lo-y.domainepublic.net, i.m.klif at gmail.com, iceca at 
chiangmai.ac.th, ices at mongol.net, ida.julsen at gmail.com, igorantic 
at yahoo.com, igotrights at yahoo.com, iimura at gol.com, ijancec at 
globalnet.hr, image.science at donau-uni.ac.at, inesbacher at 
hotmail.com, info at aa-vv.org, info at aec.at, info at art-action.org, 
info at digitalartlab.org.il, info at fournos-culture.gr, info at 
furtherfield.org, info at pank.tv, info at rybn.org, info at tonk.org, 
info at zzee.net, inge at zkm.de, innestogreffe at libero.it, iris.hoppe 
at nbsp.nl, isho at ziplip.com, ivanamar at gmail.com, james at 
teleportacia.org, jamespartaik at sympatico.ca, janakrause at berlin.de, 
janez-jansa at hotmail.com, jcm at amauta.rcp.net.pe, jebatepatak at 
yahoo.com, jelenamilo at gmx.de, jennifer.stoddart at folly.co.uk, jg at 
2009.x-i.net, joasia at i-dat.org, joe at menticulture.com, jon at 
jonathanflowers.com, jonasbjoerklund at hotmail.com, jorgen at bek.no, 
joseph at electrichands.com, josephine at funksoup.com, jp_halgand at 
pavu.com, jshaw at bennington.edu, junkemail_email1 at yahoo.com, 
jvan7052 at arts.usyd.edu.au, karen at interval.org.uk, karrrlo at 
gmail.com, katarina at opennet.org, ke_an at o-o.lt, keepintouchplease 
at free.fr, kent1 at arscenic.info, kevin at iolab.no, kirsty at 
mailodic.com, kmarmor at uvm.edu, kouros at ath.forthnet.gr, 
kristophallix at gmail.com, ksak at mail.md, kujawski at 
itaucultural.org.br, kvatzia at yahoo.com, l1 at millinfo.org, 
lalli72002 at yahoo.com, land at botport.org, laseine at free.fr, 
laurent at arsonore.net, leigh-anne_galloway at hotmail.co.uk, lemos at 
viewser.dk, lenilaperi at yahoo.com, levensen_00 at yahoo.com, 
lexicontrol at gmail.com, lilitl at hotmail.com, lindahilfling at 
yahoo.dk, list at philipgalanter.com, list at playmind.com, listes at 
biennaledeparis.org, listo at provisoire.com, lists at postspace.org, 
liv at defekt.nl, llanquin at cumshot.cl, lo-y at 
lo-y.domainepublic.net, loopcoffee at hotmail.com, lst at x257.com, 
lteixeira at porto.ucp.pt, luca.mazza.info at gmail.com, luca at 
8081.com, lucy_julie at hotmail.com, luigi at artificialia.com, 
lullinette at no-log.org, lunkpunkfunk at gmail.com, lyannehui at 
hotmail.com, m.germini at dream-escape.org, m at 1010.co.uk, 
madhyamaka73 at yahoo.com.mx, magazynsztuki at home.pl, mail at 
tzib.org, mailbox at typedown.com, mammapearl at yahoo.it, manualaccel 
at yahoo.com, mar_z at gmx.net, marc.garrett at furtherfield.org, 
marcelpeju at yahoo.ca, margaret at dream7.com, margaret at 
restartstudio.com, margrz at zrc-sazu.si, mariabackman at chello.se, 
mariabackman at comhem.se, marius.tana at gmail.com, marjan at 
kud-fp.si, marta.smolikova at ecn.cz, martket at hol.gr, mat at 
kinotek.org, math_archive at yahoo.dk, matze.schmidt at n0name.de, 
maximus8 at gmail.com, mechduck at eunet.yu, media at ezaic.de, media at 
hist.uni.wroc.pl, media at web.net, mi329 at nyu.edu, mi_ga at o-o.lt, 
mileniapopovic at yahoo.com, milovan at markovic.org, miss.gunst at 
gmx.net, morgan at morgansutherland.net, n2o at ggttctttat.com, nadjast 
at hotmail.com, nathanieltkacz at gmail.com, necropunk at gmail.com, 
netwurker at gmail.com, newmediamarketing at spacestudios.org.uk, news 
at testnews.di.uoa.gr, newsgroups at anemone.cx, nica.junker at 
gmail.com, nicofeiks at hotmail.com, nicolaecom at yahoo.com, nicolas at 
constantvzw.com, nina.samuel at gmail.com, noemata at gmail.com, nomusic 
at altern.org, notfrog at gmail.com, nr03 at fsu.edu, nsoffice at 
fosyu.org, office at backup-festival.de, office at paraflows.at, offline 
at online.ee, ohnoqt at yahoo.com, olivier at filmerlamusique.com, 
orton.akinci at gmail.com, our.artist.mroth at web.de, pallthay at 
gmail.com, parasite at calarts.edu, paul at glowinthedark.co.uk, 
pavel.sterec at culturetransfer.org, paweljanicki at interia.pl, 
petrjopetrjo at mail.ru, philemon1 at mac.com, play at ubermorgen.com, 
polymailbox at artrace.com, postmasters at thing.net, potemkin at 
freemail.hu, press at mediamatic.nl, promocion at 
laboralcentrodearte.org, rascal_heim at yahoo.com, rastas at kaapeli.fi, 
raul.molin at artfacts.net, rdusic at blue-merlin.hr, reasonpolice at 
yahoo.com, redamber7777777 at googlemail.com, redazione at digicult.it, 
relator_info at yahoo.com, rencontresplacepublique at yahoo.fr, res1h6h8 
at verizon.net, rfh at sinnenfracht.net, rodrigo at anorg.net, ronduda 
at csw.art.pl, rose.disalvo at gmail.com, ruben_ar at web.am, rubysircar 
at gmx.de, ruxandra.balaci at artexpo.ro, s.u.n at free.fr, s at 
wallflowermedia.com, s_mircheva at abv.bg, sabek007 at gmail.com, sal at 
highlala.com, samosat at msn.com, samsaramira at yahoo.com, sarah.turner 
at manchesterurbanscreens.org.uk, saschabraun at gmx.de, sciatto at 
ecn.org, seamascain at gmail.com, sebastian at rolux.org, sevo at 
kein.org, shisoqu at modukit.com, sica at dasein-design.com, sonjavuk at 
lycos.com, soustout at gmx.de, springerin at springerin.at, struppek at 
interactionfield.de, sub at urnes.net, subjekt at subjektivation.de, 
subterfluent at gmail.com, svukovic at yubc.net, syndi at entropy8.com, 
syndicate at fischkalb.com, syndicate at mandiberg.com, szmz at c3.hu, 
tanja.vujinovic at gmail.com, test at lo-y.domainepublic.net, testcase 
at asu.edu, theelectricyouth at yahoo.com, thewarinkansas at yahoo.com, 
thiothixene at gmail.com, threads at wildernesspuppets.net, thth at 
noos.fr, traction at earthlink.net, trampoline at 
active-ingredient.co.uk, troudair at gmail.com, tsila.hassine at 
gmail.com, tulpje at gmail.com, unicode at smtp.ru, unkuentz at 
modukit.com, unstablemedia at gmail.com, unsubscsribe at gmail.com, 
utopia_beach at blueyonder.co.uk, uzs106 at uni-bonn.de, valentina at 
invisible.gq.nu, vedran.kolac at gmail.com, vera at sendung.net, 
vesnamil at eunet.yu, visibility at furtherfield.org, voyd at voyd.com, 
wallace at autistici.org, wieland at filmladen.de, workshops at 
mediamatic.net, worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com, x55 at salty.org, 
xavier.ess at skynet.be, yasir.media at gmail.com, yb at imal.org, 
yukihiko at s6.dion.ne.jp, yukihiko at sfc.keio.ac.jp, zaptic at 
gmail.com, zeric at f.bg.ac.yu, zionzion61 at hotmail.com, zn at 
yubc.net, zzorlu at gmail.com <mailto:syndicate-owner at tekspost.no>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091105/b07fd057/attachment-0001.htm>

From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 00:23:25 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fr)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 00:23:25 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] [syndicate spectre] admins update
In-Reply-To: <4AF20C0B.2050209@free.fr>
References: <4AF20C0B.2050209@free.fr>
Message-ID: <4AF20CED.9050101@free.fr>

thanks

From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 00:25:57 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fr)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 00:25:57 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] well
Message-ID: <4AF20D85.30701@free.fr>

dear members,
THANKS
f.


From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 10:51:34 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 10:51:34 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] good bye
Message-ID: <375642998.1529911257414694222.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

dear admins
you are dead

[syndicate spectre] list run by n2o at ggttctttat.com

From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 10:48:02 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 10:48:02 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] REMOVE ME RIGHT NOW-your footer is too long and
 uncompliant you have been removed
In-Reply-To: <304383.57960.qm@web45611.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1156142699.1529071257414482588.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

people who find this funny are ADMINS
it's threatening to become extinct
good sleep to you, ADMIN

----- Mail Original -----
De: "thewarinkansas" <thewarinkansas at yahoo.com>
?: "fm" <fmadre at free.fr>
Cc: syndicate-owner at tekspost.no
Envoy?: Jeudi 5 Novembre 2009 10h43:19 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: Re: REMOVE ME RIGHT NOW-your footer is too long and uncompliant you have been removed



this is funny !!! i can sleep now .... 




From: fm <fmadre at free.fr> 
To: media at web.net 
Cc: syndicate-owner at tekspost.no 
Sent: Thu, November 5, 2009 3:31:55 AM 
Subject: Re: REMOVE ME RIGHT NOW 

your footer is too long and uncompliant 
you have been removed 

----- Mail Original ----- 
De: "George Lessard" < media at web.net > 
?: syndicate-owner at tekspost.no 
Envoy?: Jeudi 5 Novembre 2009 10h23:18 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne 
Objet: REMOVE ME RIGHT NOW 



I don't know this list... I never agreed to moderate it and I want off 
right away. 
I never even gave anyone permission to add my name to the list much less 
moderate it.. 

-- 
GEORGE LESSARD 

Information & Media Specialist 
6402135 Canada Inc. 

451 Norseman Drive 
Yellowknife, Northwest Territories 
X1A 2J1, Canada 

Yellowknife Land Line # (867) 873-2662 
Yellowknife Cell # (867) 445-9193 

Online Business Card: 
http://lessardcard.notlong.com 

Home e-mail media at web.net 
Alternate e-mail: mediamentor at gmail.com 

Home Pages http://mediamentor.ca 
Online Activities: http://www.web.ca/~media/index.html 
Photos: http://photosbygeorge.notlong.com 
My Public Bookmarks: http://del.icio.us/themediamentor 

Member: 
Canadian Association of Journalists http://www.caj.ca 
Canadian Artists Representation / le Front des artistes canadiennes 
http://www.carfac.ca/ 
Canadian Artists Representation Copyright Collective http://www.carcc.ca/ 






From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 12:35:11 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 12:35:11 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] yet another test
Message-ID: <289146804.1554861257420911607.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

DEAR ADMINS
your list doesn't function
I receive no mail
please send me syndicate mails
f.

From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Thu Nov  5 13:02:43 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 14:02:43 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] \\
Message-ID: <6DAC8D92-4568-43E8-B131-9810DABCA3EE@ggttctttat.com>



prova  49








From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 14:01:16 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 14:01:16 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] \\
In-Reply-To: <6DAC8D92-4568-43E8-B131-9810DABCA3EE@ggttctttat.com>
Message-ID: <1405886408.1569601257426076386.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

the can is opened

----- Mail Original -----
De: "| f | | | 3" <n2o at ggttctttat.com>
?: Syndicate at ck13.org
Envoy?: Jeudi 5 Novembre 2009 13h02:43 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: [Syndicate] \\



prova  49







_______________________________________________
Syndicate mailing list
Syndicate at ck13.org
https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate

From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 14:04:06 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 14:04:06 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] Furtherfield Blog - Share the Journey...
In-Reply-To: <4AE6CE62.1070606@furtherfield.org>
Message-ID: <684319680.1570191257426246373.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>


----- Mail Original -----
De: "info" <info at furtherfield.org>
?: Syndicate at ck13.org
Sorry for any cross posting...
----- Mail Original -----

ah ah ah!

From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Thu Nov  5 14:10:58 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 15:10:58 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] \\
In-Reply-To: <1405886408.1569601257426076386.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
References: <1405886408.1569601257426076386.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
Message-ID: <D697C01D-5FB2-4F55-B44A-0AE0A0783670@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 5, 2009, at 3:01 PM, fm wrote:

> the can is opened


it's like thinking








>
>
> ----- Mail Original -----
> De: "| f | | | 3" <n2o at ggttctttat.com>
> ?: Syndicate at ck13.org
> Envoy?: Jeudi 5 Novembre 2009 13h02:43 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam /  
> Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
> Objet: [Syndicate] \\
>
>
>
> prova  49
>


From guibertc at criticalsecret.com  Thu Nov  5 14:15:11 2009
From: guibertc at criticalsecret.com (Aliette Guibert-Certhoux)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 14:15:11 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] yet another test
In-Reply-To: <289146804.1554861257420911607.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
References: <289146804.1554861257420911607.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
Message-ID: <9eb0e3810911050515l58f73545i2d0306d82dcdc614@mail.gmail.com>

test (can be that it not arrives cause gmail -where I have installed
all my adresses-?)

2009/11/5 fm <fmadre at free.fr>:
> DEAR ADMINS
> your list doesn't function
> I receive no mail
> please send me syndicate mails
> f.
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>

From guibertc at criticalsecret.com  Thu Nov  5 14:16:15 2009
From: guibertc at criticalsecret.com (Aliette Guibert-Certhoux)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 14:16:15 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] Furtherfield Blog - Share the Journey...
In-Reply-To: <4AC0C2E7.1040502@furtherfield.org>
References: <4AC0C2E7.1040502@furtherfield.org>
Message-ID: <9eb0e3810911050516p5882829bsa60561fb00c7dfe8@mail.gmail.com>

well receiving it

2009/9/28 marc garrett <marc.garrett at furtherfield.org>:
> Sorry for any cross postings...
>
> Furtherfield Blog - Recent Posts of Interest on Media Art Practice and
> Culture.
>
> A shared space for personal reflections on contemporary art practice as part
> of life:
> living it, breathing it, making it, curating it, translating it.
>
> A selection of recent Blog entries below,
> to read more visit - http://blog.furtherfield.org
>
>
> Marc Garrett.
> Not Always Digital But From the Same Place...
>
> "I possess no desire for the singular and absolute approach of using my art
> and creative projects as a hammer to promote a technologically determined
> agenda. Technology is just one medium of a much larger mix of things,
> allowing flexible space for an eclectic expansion of today's very
> contemporary art related endevours. Furthermore, I am dedicated to grass
> roots art and the organisations that support them. The use of technology has
> been extremely useful in bringing about a whole new art culture that
> challenges traditional art controls, connecting beyond top-down imposed gate
> keeping remits that are only in place to serve a privileged elite. It lets
> the makers and critical thinkers who are genuinely engaged in art and
> culture at deeper levels, to break through the glass ceiling that many have
> experienced world-wide." http://blog.furtherfield.org/?q=node/315
>
> Aileen Derieg.
> Overland: Crossing Borders.
>
> "As passports are now "enhanced" for security with RFID chips and biometric
> photos, the conditions of inequality based on the nationality of one's
> passport remain at least as rigid as ever, despite the patent absurdity of
> that. In the small world that I live in, a substantial number of people
> speak multiple languages and have several different passports, and in the
> mid-90s I knew a number of people whose Austrian residence permits were
> attached to passports issued by countries that had meanwhile ceased to exist
> as such, which made the renewal of an expired passport extremely
> complicated. Opportunities to study or work somewhere else should not be
> dependent on something as random and arbitrary as "nationality"."
> http://blog.furtherfield.org/?q=node/311
>
> Ruth Catlow.
> Overland: 36hrs Linz to Istanbul with border crossings.
>
> "At 1 o'clock in the morning we were woken by an alarming banging on the
> door, and a number of men shouting in languages we didn't understand,
> interspersed with "passport control! polizei! open! hell-o!". Then more
> agitated pounding, more shouting, different voices. The train remained
> stationery. We played dead under our blankets. I could think of nothing else
> to do than wait for them to go away. Then torch lights shone in through our
> window and someone attempted to open the window from the outside while
> Aileen tried to close it again. Only when she recognised our conductor
> looking very flustered outside the window did we realise that we must have
> misunderstood his instructions and we sheepishly unlocked the door. A very
> irritated passport official demanded to know what we had been drinking. The
> conductor told us later that there were over 10 officials trying to gain
> entry to our cabin. We tried to explain but still have no idea what he
> thought we were doing." http://blog.furtherfield.org/?q=node/301
>
> Helen Varley Jamieson.
> after 090909.
>
> "the day began for me at 4am - no, make that 3am, with the ramadan drumming
> & yelling in the street to get everyone up in time for breakfast before
> daylight. then i dozed until my alarm went off at 4am, & got up to make
> coffee, check my email for last minute emergencies, & make the links to the
> stages live. my first 090909 HQ was my humble hostel bedroom. at 5am
> istanbul time everything kicked off in the 090909 foyer, where 20 online
> audience members plus an as-yet-unknown number at nodes in canada (surrey &
> calgary) & new zealand (dowse art gallery & hutt city libraries) where
> gathered to celebrate the start of 090909."
> http://blog.furtherfield.org/?q=node/304
>
>
> --------------------------------->
>
>
> More about The Furtherfield Blog:
> This multi-blog is a place to intuitively explore media arts and related
> practices, together, as it occurs, to develop understanding and to
> learn, without any pressure to formulate conclusions, it is about
> experience and process, the bits in between. Set up in Autumn 2006,
> initially as a place for informal, day to day exchange between members
> of the Furtherfield.org team, including editors/reviewers. We soon
> discovered this format suited some people more than others and are now
> open to new contributors. The blog is not intended as a platform to
> promote particular projects. Instead it invites individuals to explore
> their own perspectives on their own terms; personal thoughts, emotional
> responses and critical intentions rarely publicly discussed elsewhere.
>
> Other Info:
>
> Furtherfield
> http://www.furtherfield.org
>
> We are on Twitter
> http://twitter.com/furtherfield
>
> Other reviews/articles/interviews
> http://www.furtherfield.org/reviews.php
>
> The Netbehaviour list
> http://www.netbehaviour.org/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>

From jp_halgand at pavu.com  Thu Nov  5 14:23:46 2009
From: jp_halgand at pavu.com (jp_halgand at pavu.com)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 14:23:46 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] chocolate crookies
Message-ID: <1257427426.4af2d1e2d0dbf@imp.online.net>


ah

any birds?

i bring the umbrella

From media at ezaic.de  Thu Nov  5 14:52:49 2009
From: media at ezaic.de (Claudia Westermann)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 14:52:49 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] now
Message-ID: <4AF2D8B1.7040100@ezaic.de>


this should work hopefully still

with non-memeber mails being rejected without moderation and
member mails let through without moderation as well


let's see



From sondheim at panix.com  Thu Nov  5 16:54:24 2009
From: sondheim at panix.com (Alan Sondheim)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 10:54:24 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [Syndicate] now
In-Reply-To: <4AF2D8B1.7040100@ezaic.de>
References: <4AF2D8B1.7040100@ezaic.de>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0911051054120.11999@panix3.panix.com>



testing

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Claudia Westermann wrote:

>
> this should work hopefully still
>
> with non-memeber mails being rejected without moderation and
> member mails let through without moderation as well
>
>
> let's see
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>


==
email archive: http://sondheim.rupamsunyata.org/
webpage http://www.alansondheim.org sondheimat gmail.com, panix.com
==

From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 16:57:53 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 16:57:53 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] now
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0911051054120.11999@panix3.panix.com>
Message-ID: <543325435.1608381257436673996.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

woodwork squeaks

----- Mail Original -----
De: "Alan Sondheim" <sondheim at panix.com>
?: "SYNDICATE ||" <syndicate at ck13.org>
Envoy?: Jeudi 5 Novembre 2009 16h54:24 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: Re: [Syndicate] now



testing

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Claudia Westermann wrote:

>
> this should work hopefully still
>
> with non-memeber mails being rejected without moderation and
> member mails let through without moderation as well
>
>
> let's see
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>


==
email archive: http://sondheim.rupamsunyata.org/
webpage http://www.alansondheim.org sondheimat gmail.com, panix.com
==
_______________________________________________
Syndicate mailing list
Syndicate at ck13.org
https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate

From sondheim at panix.com  Thu Nov  5 17:07:59 2009
From: sondheim at panix.com (Alan Sondheim)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 11:07:59 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [Syndicate] now
In-Reply-To: <543325435.1608381257436673996.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
References: <543325435.1608381257436673996.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0911051107480.490@panix3.panix.com>



woodwork leaves the list

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, fm wrote:

> woodwork squeaks

----- Mail Original -----
De: "Alan Sondheim" <sondheim at panix.com>
?: "SYNDICATE ||" <syndicate at ck13.org>
Envoy?: Jeudi 5 Novembre 2009 16h54:24 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: Re: [Syndicate] now



testing

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Claudia Westermann wrote:

>
> this should work hopefully still
>
> with non-memeber mails being rejected without moderation and
> member mails let through without moderation as well
>
>
> let's see
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>


==
email archive: http://sondheim.rupamsunyata.org/
webpage http://www.alansondheim.org sondheimat gmail.com, panix.com
==
_______________________________________________
Syndicate mailing list
Syndicate at ck13.org
https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
_______________________________________________
Syndicate mailing list
Syndicate at ck13.org
https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate


==
email archive: http://sondheim.rupamsunyata.org/
webpage http://www.alansondheim.org sondheimat gmail.com, panix.com
==

From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 17:09:22 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 17:09:22 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] now
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0911051107480.490@panix3.panix.com>
Message-ID: <1397345604.1611151257437362338.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

splinters remain in our skins

----- Mail Original -----
De: "Alan Sondheim" <sondheim at panix.com>
?: "SYNDICATE ||" <syndicate at ck13.org>
Envoy?: Jeudi 5 Novembre 2009 17h07:59 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: Re: [Syndicate] now



woodwork leaves the list

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, fm wrote:

> woodwork squeaks

----- Mail Original -----
De: "Alan Sondheim" <sondheim at panix.com>
?: "SYNDICATE ||" <syndicate at ck13.org>
Envoy?: Jeudi 5 Novembre 2009 16h54:24 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: Re: [Syndicate] now



testing

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Claudia Westermann wrote:

>
> this should work hopefully still
>
> with non-memeber mails being rejected without moderation and
> member mails let through without moderation as well
>
>
> let's see
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>


==
email archive: http://sondheim.rupamsunyata.org/
webpage http://www.alansondheim.org sondheimat gmail.com, panix.com
==
_______________________________________________
Syndicate mailing list
Syndicate at ck13.org
https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
_______________________________________________
Syndicate mailing list
Syndicate at ck13.org
https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate


==
email archive: http://sondheim.rupamsunyata.org/
webpage http://www.alansondheim.org sondheimat gmail.com, panix.com
==
_______________________________________________
Syndicate mailing list
Syndicate at ck13.org
https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate

From domenicoolivero at libero.it  Thu Nov  5 19:16:40 2009
From: domenicoolivero at libero.it (domenicoolivero at libero.it)
Date: Thu,  5 Nov 2009 19:16:40 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] unsubscribe unsubscire unsubscibe
Message-ID: <KSNERS$3D33468A7A4BD11F791B7E56DAA99DB9@libero.it>

---------- Initial Header -----------

>From      : syndicate-bounces at ck13.org
To          : syndicate at ck13.org
Cc          : 
Date      : Mon, 05 Oct 2009 12:04:48 +0200
Subject : [Syndicate] 0-) n0name nachrichten #139







> |<------ Breite: 72 Zeichen - Fixed Width Font: Courier New, 10 ------>|
> 
> 0-) n0name nachrichten #139 Mi., 03.06.2009 11:06 CET
> 
> *Inhalt/Contents*
> 
> 1. Debord - La Soci?t? du spectacle.srt als .txt 3
> 2. verteidigt das Portal der Fantasie
>    aus: _3000/futuristische Phantasmen und aktuelle Fantasien 
>    der Technokultur 3.2_ (Fortsetzung aus nn #138)
> 
> 32 KB, ca. 19 DIN A4-Seiten
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> 1.
> 
> Debord - La Soci?t? du spectacle.srt als .txt 3
> 
> 
> 457
> 00:26:44,877 --> 00:26:46,491
> Das diffuse Spektakul?re
> 
> 458
> 00:26:46,633 --> 00:26:49,097
> begleitet den Waren?berfluss,
> 
> 459
> 00:26:49,286 --> 00:26:53,331
> d.h. die ungest?rte Entwicklung des modernen Kapitalismus.
> 
> 460
> 00:26:55,239 --> 00:26:58,569
> Jede Ware dabei f?r sich genommen
> 
> 461
> 00:26:58,664 --> 00:27:01,597
> ist gerechtfertigt im Namen der Gr??e der
> 
> 462
> 00:27:01,710 --> 00:27:03,131
> Gesamtproduktion von Gegenst?nden,
> 
> 463
> 00:27:03,277 --> 00:27:06,265
> deren apologetischer Katalog das Spektakel ist.
> 
> 464
> 00:27:06,417 --> 00:27:10,213
> Unvereinbare Behauptungen dr?ngen sich auf der B?hne des vereinigten
> 
> 465
> 00:27:10,340 --> 00:27:13,033
> Spektakels der ?berfluss-?konomie,
> 
> 466
> 00:27:13,238 --> 00:27:15,663
> ebenso wie verschiedene Star-Waren
> 
> 467
> 00:27:15,789 --> 00:27:18,700
> gleichzeitig ihre widerspr?chlichen
> 
> 468
> 00:27:18,845 --> 00:27:20,481
> Einrichtungspl?ne der Gesellschaft vortragen,
> 
> 469
> 00:27:20,639 --> 00:27:22,669
> in der das Spektakel der Kraftwagen
> 
> 470
> 00:27:22,766 --> 00:27:26,384
> einen vollkommenen Verkehr verlangt, der die Altst?dte zerst?rt,
> 
> 471
> 00:27:26,561 --> 00:27:30,615
> w?hrend das Spektakel der Stadt selbst Museen-Viertel braucht.
> 
> 472
> 00:27:30,861 --> 00:27:34,172
> Daher wird die bereits problematische Zufriedenheit,
> 
> 473
> 00:27:34,448 --> 00:27:38,180
> die angeblich dem Konsum der Gesamtheit eignet,
> 
> 474
> 00:27:38,267 --> 00:27:40,204
> unmittelbar verf?lscht,
> 
> 475
> 00:27:40,329 --> 00:27:44,528
> indem der wirkliche Konsument direkt nur eine Aufeinanderfolge
> 
> 476
> 00:27:44,641 --> 00:27:47,449
> von Bruchst?cken dieses Warengl?cks ber?hren kann,
> 
> 477
> 00:27:47,642 --> 00:27:49,500
> denen jedesmal
> 
> 478
> 00:27:49,613 --> 00:27:54,345
> die der Gesamtheit zugeschriebene Qualit?t offensichtlich fehlt.
> 
> 479
> 00:27:54,975 --> 00:27:58,502
> Jede bestimmte Ware k?mpft f?r sich selbst,
> 
> 480
> 00:27:58,675 --> 00:28:00,770
> kann die anderen nicht anerkennen,
> 
> 481
> 00:28:00,919 --> 00:28:04,572
> will sich ?berall durchsetzen, als ob sie die einzige sei.
> 
> 482
> 00:28:04,887 --> 00:28:08,832
> Damit wird das Spektakel zum epischen Gesang dieses Zusammensto?es,
> 
> 483
> 00:28:09,052 --> 00:28:12,533
> den der Fall keines Troja beenden k?nnte.
> 
> 484
> 00:28:12,887 --> 00:28:16,109
> Das Spektakel besingt nicht die M?nner und ihre Waffen,
> 
> 485
> 00:28:16,297 --> 00:28:19,399
> sondern die Waren und ihre Leidenschaften.
> 
> 486
> 00:28:19,745 --> 00:28:21,659
> In diesem blinden Kampf
> 
> 487
> 00:28:21,756 --> 00:28:24,430
> vollbringt jede Ware, indem sie sich von ihrer Leidenschaft 
> hinrei?en l?sst,
> 
> 488
> 00:28:24,607 --> 00:28:28,677
> Bewusstlos ein H?heres:
> 
> 489
> 00:28:28,949 --> 00:28:31,264
> das Welt-Werden der Ware,
> 
> 490
> 00:28:31,382 --> 00:28:34,925
> das ebenso das zur-Ware-Werden der Welt ist.
> 
> 491
> 00:28:35,153 --> 00:28:38,517
> So k?mpft sich, dank einer List der Warenvernunft,
> 
> 492
> 00:28:38,782 --> 00:28:41,990
> das Besondere der Ware aneinander ab,
> 
> 493
> 00:28:43,026 --> 00:28:45,168
> w?hrend die Warenform
> 
> 494
> 00:28:45,404 --> 00:28:48,061
> auf ihre absolute Verwirklichung zugeht.
> 
> 495
> 00:28:49,514 --> 00:28:52,723
> Im Bild der gl?cklichen Vereinheitlichung der Gesellschaft
> 
> 496
> 00:28:52,852 --> 00:28:54,127
> durch den Konsum
> 
> 497
> 00:28:54,316 --> 00:28:56,852
> ist die reale Teilung zur?ckgestellt
> 
> 498
> 00:28:57,049 --> 00:29:00,608
> nur bis zum n?chsten Nichterf?llen im Konsumierbaren.
> 
> 499
> 00:29:01,363 --> 00:29:04,972
> Jedes besondere Produkt, das die Hoffnung darstellen soll
> 
> 500
> 00:29:05,085 --> 00:29:06,858
> auf eine blitzschnelle Abk?rzung,
> 
> 501
> 00:29:07,003 --> 00:29:10,866
> um endlich ins gelobte Land des totalen Konsums zu gelangen,
> 
> 502
> 00:29:11,252 --> 00:29:14,244
> wird der Reihe nach feierlich pr?sentiert
> 
> 503
> 00:29:14,334 --> 00:29:17,236
> als die entscheidende Einzigartigkeit.
> 
> 504
> 00:29:18,283 --> 00:29:21,884
> Aber wie im Falle der augenblicklichen Verbreitung
> 
> 505
> 00:29:22,045 --> 00:29:25,176
> der Moden von scheinbar aristokratischen Vornamen,
> 
> 506
> 00:29:25,354 --> 00:29:29,641
> die von fast allen gleichaltrigen Individuen getragen werden,
> 
> 507
> 00:29:29,803 --> 00:29:32,654
> so kann der Gegenstand, von dem eine einzigartige Macht erwartet wird,
> 
> 508
> 00:29:32,767 --> 00:29:35,723
> nur dadurch der Andacht der Massen geweiht werden,
> 
> 509
> 00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:39,644
> dass er in einer hinreichend gro?en Zahl von Exemplaren 
> vervielf?ltigt wurde,
> 
> 510
> 00:29:39,799 --> 00:29:42,471
> um massenhaft konsumiert zu werden.
> 
> 511
> 00:29:42,754 --> 00:29:46,030
> Der Prestigecharakter dieses beliebigen Produkts
> 
> 512
> 00:29:46,187 --> 00:29:48,841
> kommt ihm nur dadurch zu, dass es f?r einen Moment
> 
> 513
> 00:29:49,014 --> 00:29:50,983
> im Zentrum des gesellschaftlichen Lebens gestanden hat,
> 
> 514
> 00:29:51,148 --> 00:29:52,880
> als das offenbarte Mysterium
> 
> 515
> 00:29:53,022 --> 00:29:55,604
> des Endzwecks der Produktion.
> 
> 516
> 00:29:56,990 --> 00:29:59,995
> Der Gegenstand, der im Spektakel ein Prestige hatte, wird vulg?r,
> 
> 517
> 00:30:00,172 --> 00:30:03,880
> sobald er an den einzelnen Konsumenten
> 
> 518
> 00:30:04,108 --> 00:30:06,900
> und gleichzeitig an alle anderen gelangt.
> 
> 519
> 00:30:07,093 --> 00:30:09,985
> Zu sp?t enth?llt er seine wesentliche Armut,
> 
> 520
> 00:30:10,146 --> 00:30:13,516
> die die nat?rliche Folge des Elends seiner Produktion ist.
> 
> 521
> 00:30:13,784 --> 00:30:14,776
> Aber schon
> 
> 522
> 00:30:14,910 --> 00:30:18,800
> tr?gt ein anderer Gegenstand die Rechtfertigung des Systems in sich
> 
> 523
> 00:30:18,981 --> 00:30:21,871
> und die Forderung nach Anerkennung.
> 
> 524
> 00:30:24,343 --> 00:30:26,627
> Der Betrug der Befriedigung
> 
> 525
> 00:30:26,784 --> 00:30:29,886
> muss sich selbst denunzieren, indem er sich erneuert,
> 
> 526
> 00:30:30,020 --> 00:30:32,115
> indem er die Ver?nderung der Produkte
> 
> 527
> 00:30:32,295 --> 00:30:35,445
> und der allgemeinen Produktionsbedingungen verfolgt.
> 
> 528
> 00:30:35,618 --> 00:30:38,985
> Was mit der vollkommensten Unversch?mtheit
> 
> 529
> 00:30:39,130 --> 00:30:42,476
> seine eigene definitive Vortrefflichkeit behauptet hat, ?ndert 
> sich dennoch,
> 
> 530
> 00:30:43,004 --> 00:30:44,683
> im diffusen,
> 
> 531
> 00:30:44,822 --> 00:30:47,598
> aber auch im konzentrierten Spektakel,
> 
> 532
> 00:30:47,727 --> 00:30:50,443
> und allein das System muss fortdauern:
> 
> 533
> 00:30:50,665 --> 00:30:53,085
> Stalin wie die veraltete Ware
> 
> 534
> 00:30:53,232 --> 00:30:57,220
> werden von eben denen denunziert, die sie eingef?hrt haben.
> 
> 535
> 00:30:57,460 --> 00:31:00,246
> Jede neue L?ge der Werbung
> 
> 536
> 00:31:00,468 --> 00:31:03,644
> ist auch das Eingest?ndnis ihrer vorigen L?ge.
> 
> 537
> 00:31:03,862 --> 00:31:07,373
> Jeder Sturz einer Gestalt der totalit?ren Gewalt
> 
> 538
> 00:31:07,507 --> 00:31:10,195
> offenbart die illusorische Gemeinschaft,
> 
> 539
> 00:31:10,340 --> 00:31:12,168
> die sie einstimmig guthie?
> 
> 540
> 00:31:12,326 --> 00:31:17,264
> und die doch nur eine Anh?ufung von illusionslosen Einsamkeiten war.
> 
> 541
> 00:31:18,137 --> 00:31:21,118
> Was das Spektakel als dauerhaft pr?sentiert,
> 
> 542
> 00:31:21,263 --> 00:31:23,155
> ist auf die Ver?nderung gegr?ndet
> 
> 543
> 00:31:23,283 --> 00:31:25,208
> und muss sich mit seiner Basis ver?ndern.
> 
> 544
> 00:31:25,428 --> 00:31:27,840
> Das Spektakel ist absolut dogmatisch
> 
> 545
> 00:31:28,003 --> 00:31:32,228
> und kann doch zugleich zu keinem einzigen soliden Dogma f?hren.
> 
> 546
> 00:31:32,419 --> 00:31:34,324
> F?r das Spektakel h?rt nichts auf;
> 
> 547
> 00:31:34,521 --> 00:31:36,576
> dies ist sein nat?rlicher
> 
> 548
> 00:31:36,737 --> 00:31:39,552
> und dennoch seiner Neigung entgegengesetztester Zustand.
> 
> 549
> 00:31:42,307 --> 00:31:45,416
> Die unwirkliche Einheit, die das Spektakel proklamiert,
> 
> 550
> 00:31:45,511 --> 00:31:48,379
> ist die Maske der Klassenteilung,
> 
> 551
> 00:31:48,523 --> 00:31:52,327
> auf der die reale Einheit der kapitalistischen Produktionsweise 
> beruht.
> 
> 552
> 00:31:52,527 --> 00:31:55,235
> Was die Produzenten verpflichtet,
> 
> 553
> 00:31:55,330 --> 00:31:57,197
> am Bau der Welt teilzunehmen,
> 
> 554
> 00:31:57,342 --> 00:31:59,542
> ist auch das, was sie davon ausschlie?t.
> 
> 555
> 00:31:59,694 --> 00:32:03,265
> Was die von ihren lokalen und nationalen
> 
> 556
> 00:32:03,442 --> 00:32:07,206
> Schranken befreiten Menschen verbindet, ist auch das, was sie 
> voneinander entfernt.
> 
> 557
> 00:32:07,321 --> 00:32:10,445
> Was zur Vertiefung des Rationellen verpflichtet,
> 
> 558
> 00:32:10,581 --> 00:32:13,865
> ist auch das, was das Irrationelle der hierarchischen
> 
> 559
> 00:32:13,994 --> 00:32:16,195
> Ausbeutung und der Repression n?hrt.
> 
> 560
> 00:32:16,399 --> 00:32:19,410
> Was die abstrakte Gewalt der Gesellschaft erzeugt,
> 
> 561
> 00:32:19,604 --> 00:32:22,308
> schafft auch ihre konkrete Unfreiheit.
> 
> 562
> 00:32:27,332 --> 00:32:31,096
> <i>Leben wir denn, Proletarier, leben wir? </i>
> 
> 563
> 00:32:31,530 --> 00:32:35,776
> <i>Dieses Zeitalter, welches wir sind - und in welchem alles, </i>
> 
> 564
> 00:32:35,977 --> 00:32:39,403
> <i>was wir bedeuten, nicht mehr uns geh?rt, ist das ein Leben?</i>
> 
> 565
> 00:32:39,660 --> 00:32:43,312
> <i>Und k?nnen wir denn nicht wahrnehmen, was uns mit dem Verflie?en 
> der Jahre unaufh?rlich entgeht?</i>
> 
> 566
> 00:32:48,963 --> 00:32:52,273
> <i>Sind nicht Schlaf und Essen nur schwache Medizin gegen die 
> Krankheit,</i>
> 
> 567
> 00:32:52,334 --> 00:32:55,624
> <i>die an uns nagt ?  Und ist die, die wir die letzte nennen,</i>
> 
> 568
> 00:32:56,036 --> 00:32:59,583
> <i>nicht nur eine Verdopplung aller bisherigen ?</i>
> 
> 569
> 00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:03,000
> <i>Ist der Tod nicht nur ein letzter Anfall der Leiden, </i>
> 
> 570
> 00:33:03,266 --> 00:33:06,435
> <i>die wir mit uns selbst zur Welt gebracht haben ?</i>
> 
> 571
> 00:33:09,183 --> 00:33:12,470
> Die kapitalistische Produktion hat den Raum vereinigt,
> 
> 572
> 00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:15,991
> der von keinen Au?engesellschaften mehr begrenzt ist.
> 
> 573
> 00:33:16,176 --> 00:33:21,246
> Diese Vereinigung ist zugleich ein extensiver und intensiver
> 
> 574
> 00:33:21,435 --> 00:33:23,385
> Prozess der Banalisierung.
> 
> 575
> 00:33:23,719 --> 00:33:27,050
> So wie die Akkumulation der
> 
> 576
> 00:33:27,179 --> 00:33:29,002
> f?r den abstrakten Raum
> 
> 577
> 00:33:29,176 --> 00:33:30,904
> des Marktes in Serie produzierten Waren
> 
> 578
> 00:33:31,033 --> 00:33:33,404
> alle regionalen und gesetzlichen Schranken
> 
> 579
> 00:33:33,554 --> 00:33:36,857
> und alle korporativen Beschr?nkungen des Mittelalters, die
> 
> 580
> 00:33:37,004 --> 00:33:39,971
> die Qualit?t der handwerklichen Produktion aufrechterhielten, brechen 
> musste,
> 
> 581
> 00:33:40,153 --> 00:33:44,144
> musste sie auch die Autonomie und die Qualit?t der Orte aufl?sen.
> 
> 582
> 00:33:44,326 --> 00:33:47,059
> Diese Macht der Homogenisierung
> 
> 583
> 00:33:47,192 --> 00:33:49,038
> ist die schwere Artillerie,
> 
> 584
> 00:33:49,199 --> 00:33:52,416
> die alle chinesischen Mauern in den Grund geschossen hat.
> 
> 585
> 00:33:55,089 --> 00:33:58,575
> Um immer identischer mit sich selbst zu werden,
> 
> 586
> 00:33:58,735 --> 00:34:02,214
> um sich der unbeweglichen Eint?nigkeit m?glichst weit zu n?hern,
> 
> 587
> 00:34:02,403 --> 00:34:04,909
> wird der freie Raum der Ware
> 
> 588
> 00:34:05,087 --> 00:34:09,381
> k?nftig st?ndig abge?ndert und neugebildet.
> 
> 589
> 00:34:11,110 --> 00:34:14,615
> Diese Gesellschaft, die die geographische Entfernung aufhebt,
> 
> 590
> 00:34:14,834 --> 00:34:17,262
> bildet sie in ihrem Inneren
> 
> 591
> 00:34:17,393 --> 00:34:20,241
> als spektakul?re Trennung.
> 
> 592
> 00:34:22,677 --> 00:34:25,771
> Nebenprodukt der Warenzirkulation,
> 
> 593
> 00:34:25,912 --> 00:34:29,377
> l?sst die als Konsum betrachtete menschliche Zirkulation,
> 
> 594
> 00:34:29,613 --> 00:34:32,555
> der Tourismus, sich im wesentlichen auf die Mu?e zur?ckf?hren,
> 
> 595
> 00:34:32,723 --> 00:34:35,675
> das zu besichtigen, was banal geworden ist.
> 
> 596
> 00:34:35,959 --> 00:34:39,860
> Die ?konomische Erschlie?ung des Besuchs verschiedener Orte
> 
> 597
> 00:34:39,998 --> 00:34:43,766
> ist bereits von selbst die Garantie ihrer Gleichwertigkeit.
> 
> 598
> 00:34:44,013 --> 00:34:47,939
> Dieselbe Modernisierung, die der Reise die Zeit entzogen hat,
> 
> 599
> 00:34:48,134 --> 00:34:51,493
> hat ihr auch die Realit?t des Raums genommen.
> 
> 600
> 00:34:52,210 --> 00:34:55,927
> <i>Die Gesellschaft, die auf der Expansion der entfremdeten </i>
> 
> 601
> 00:34:56,400 --> 00:35:00,680
> <i>industriellen Arbeit beruht, wird so ungesund, laut, h?sslich und 
> schmutzig </i>
> 
> 602
> 00:35:01,067 --> 00:35:04,890
> <i>wie eine Fabrik.</i>
> 
> 603
> 00:35:07,772 --> 00:35:10,528
> Die Gesellschaft, die ihre gesamte Umgebung nach ihrem Bild formt,
> 
> 604
> 00:35:10,606 --> 00:35:13,151
> hat sich eine spezielle Technik geschaffen,
> 
> 605
> 00:35:13,314 --> 00:35:16,196
> um die konkrete Basis dieser Aufgabengruppe zu gestalten:
> 
> 606
> 00:35:16,327 --> 00:35:17,924
> ihr Territorium selbst.
> 
> 607
> 00:35:18,142 --> 00:35:21,912
> Der Urbanismus ist diese Inbesitznahme der nat?rlichen
> 
> 608
> 00:35:22,075 --> 00:35:24,433
> und menschlichen Umwelt durch den Kapitalismus, der,
> 
> 609
> 00:35:24,614 --> 00:35:28,085
> indem er sich logisch zur absoluten Herrschaft entwickelt,
> 
> 610
> 00:35:28,275 --> 00:35:34,314
> jetzt das Ganze des Raums als seine eigene Ausstattung umarbeiten kann 
> und muss.
> 
> 611
> 00:35:35,925 --> 00:35:39,795
> <i>?... der Mensch kehrt in die H?hlenwohnung zur?ck, </i>
> 
> 612
> 00:35:39,923 --> 00:35:43,697
> <i>... die er nur mehr prek?r bewohnt, als eine fremde Macht, </i>
> 
> 613
> 00:35:43,748 --> 00:35:47,338
> <i>die sich ihm t?glich entziehn, aus der er t?glich, </i>
> 
> 614
> 00:35:47,380 --> 00:35:51,280
> <i>wenn er nicht zahlt, herausgeworfen werden kann. </i>
> 
> 615
> 00:35:51,342 --> 00:35:55,000
> <i>Dies Totenhaus muss er bezahlen.?</i>
> 
> 616
> 00:35:55,064 --> 00:35:57,948
> <i>Marx, 1844 Pariser Manuskripte</i>
> 
> 617
> 00:35:59,729 --> 00:36:03,299
> Wenn alle technischen Kr?fte der kapitalistischen ?konomie
> 
> 618
> 00:36:03,396 --> 00:36:06,255
> als trennungschaffende Kr?fte zu verstehen sind,
> 
> 619
> 00:36:06,444 --> 00:36:08,067
> handelt es sich im Fall des Urbanismus
> 
> 620
> 00:36:08,247 --> 00:36:11,544
> um die Erschlie?ung ihrer allgemeinen Basis,
> 
> 621
> 00:36:11,690 --> 00:36:14,578
> um die Behandlung des f?r ihre Entfaltung geeigneten Bodens;
> 
> 622
> 00:36:14,751 --> 00:36:17,818
> um die Technik der Trennung selbst.
> 
> 623
> 00:36:18,419 --> 00:36:21,251
> Zum ersten Mal ist eine neue Architektur,
> 
> 624
> 00:36:21,419 --> 00:36:24,696
> die in jeder fr?heren Epoche vorbehalten war
> 
> 625
> 00:36:24,826 --> 00:36:27,058
> der Befriedigung der herrschenden Klassen,
> 
> 626
> 00:36:27,187 --> 00:36:29,613
> direkt den Armen zugedacht.
> 
> 627
> 00:36:30,930 --> 00:36:33,983
> Das formale Elend und die riesenhafte Ausdehnung
> 
> 628
> 00:36:34,185 --> 00:36:36,287
> dieser neuen Wohnerfahrung
> 
> 629
> 00:36:36,449 --> 00:36:39,126
> sind die Folge ihres Massencharakters,
> 
> 630
> 00:36:39,355 --> 00:36:42,621
> den sowohl ihre Bestimmung
> 
> 631
> 00:36:42,849 --> 00:36:45,404
> als auch die modernen Bedingungen der Bauweise implizieren.
> 
> 632
> 00:36:45,732 --> 00:36:47,632
> Die autorit?re Entscheidung,
> 
> 633
> 00:36:47,794 --> 00:36:51,781
> die den Raum abstrakt zu einem Raum der Abstraktion macht,
> 
> 634
> 00:36:51,926 --> 00:36:56,555
> steht nat?rlich im Zentrum dieser modernen Konstruktions-Bedingungen.
> 
> 635
> 00:36:56,884 --> 00:36:58,857
> Die ?berschrittene Wachstumsschwelle
> 
> 636
> 00:36:58,986 --> 00:37:01,000
> der materiellen Macht der Gesellschaft
> 
> 637
> 00:37:01,097 --> 00:37:04,445
> und der R?ckstand in der Bewussten Beherrschung dieser Macht
> 
> 638
> 00:37:04,574 --> 00:37:06,819
> treten im Urbanismus offen zu Tage.
> 
> 639
> 00:37:07,175 --> 00:37:10,781
> Die Umwelt, die immer ?berst?rzter rekonstruiert wird
> 
> 640
> 00:37:10,983 --> 00:37:14,719
> zwecks repressiver Kontrolle und Profitmacherei,
> 
> 641
> 00:37:14,937 --> 00:37:18,641
> wird gleichzeitig immer br?chiger und treibt von vornherein zur 
> Zerst?rung an.
> 
> 642
> 00:37:19,029 --> 00:37:22,773
> Der Kapitalismus in seinem spektakul?ren Stadium reproduziert alles 
> als Schund
> 
> 643
> 00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:26,945
> und produziert Gro?br?nde. Auf diese Weise wird seine Ausstattung
> 
> 644
> 00:37:27,171 --> 00:37:30,745
> ?berall so feuergef?hrlich wie eine H?here Schule in Frankreich.
> 
> 645
> 00:37:31,102 --> 00:37:33,968
> Die Geschichte, die diese d?mmernde Welt bedroht,
> 
> 646
> 00:37:34,125 --> 00:37:38,665
> ist auch die Kraft, die den Raum der erlebten Zeit unterwerfen kann.
> 
> 647
> 00:37:38,976 --> 00:37:43,275
> Die proletarische Revolution ist diese Kritik der Geographie vom 
> Menschen,
> 
> 648
> 00:37:43,453 --> 00:37:46,768
> in der die Individuen und Gemeinschaften
> 
> 649
> 00:37:46,897 --> 00:37:49,989
> die Landschaft und die Ereignisse konstruieren m?ssen,
> 
> 650
> 00:37:50,215 --> 00:37:52,282
> die der Aneignung entsprechen -
> 
> 651
> 00:37:52,368 --> 00:37:54,415
> nicht mehr nur ihrer Arbeit,
> 
> 652
> 00:37:54,612 --> 00:37:56,495
> sondern ihrer gesamten Geschichte.
> 
> 653
> 00:37:56,675 --> 00:37:58,861
> In diesem bewegten Raum des Spiels
> 
> 654
> 00:37:58,956 --> 00:38:02,288
> und der freigew?hlten Variationen der Spielregeln
> 
> 655
> 00:38:02,417 --> 00:38:04,799
> kann die Autonomie des Ortes wiedergefunden werden,
> 
> 656
> 00:38:04,912 --> 00:38:08,179
> ohne eine neue ausschlie?liche Bindung an den Boden einzuf?hren,
> 
> 657
> 00:38:08,297 --> 00:38:09,241
> und dadurch
> 
> 658
> 00:38:09,415 --> 00:38:11,871
> die Wirklichkeit der Reise zur?ckbringen
> 
> 659
> 00:38:12,060 --> 00:38:13,036
> und des Lebens,
> 
> 660
> 00:38:13,198 --> 00:38:17,629
> dass als Reise begriffen wird, die in sich selbst all ihren Sinn hat.
> 
> 661
> 00:39:35,081 --> 00:39:37,552
> - What's your pleasure?
> - Whiskey.
> 
> 662
> 00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:55,600
> Welch ein Schmelztiegel !
> 
> 663
> 00:39:58,602 --> 00:40:02,602
> Alle andren Orte sind wie Kindergarten verglichen mit diesem hier.
> 
> 664
> 00:40:02,620 --> 00:40:05,000
> Es duftet derartig s?ndig.
> 
> 665
> 00:40:05,604 --> 00:40:09,604
> Ich h?tte nicht gedacht, dass ein solcher Ort anders existierte als 
> in meiner eignen Vorstellung. 
> 
> 666
> 00:40:10,205 --> 00:40:15,105
> Es hat die gespenstige Vertrautheit eines halbvergessnen Traums.
> 
> 667
> 00:40:15,100 --> 00:40:17,306
> Alles k?nnte hier geschehen,
> 
> 668
> 00:40:17,307 --> 00:40:19,307
> in jedem Augenblick.
> 
> 669
> 00:40:21,516 --> 00:40:24,727
> Die Zeit der Produktion, die Zeit als Ware,
> 
> 670
> 00:40:24,901 --> 00:40:28,395
> ist eine unendliche Akkumulation von gleichwertigen Intervallen.
> 
> 671
> 00:40:28,621 --> 00:40:31,095
> Sie ist die Abstraktion der unwiederbringlichen Zeit,
> 
> 672
> 00:40:31,270 --> 00:40:34,533
> deren Abschnitte alle auf dem Chronometer
> 
> 673
> 00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:37,422
> ihre alleinige quantitative Gleichheit beweisen m?ssen.
> 
> 674
> 00:40:39,281 --> 00:40:42,661
> Diese Zeit ist in ihrer ganzen Wirklichkeit,
> 
> 675
> 00:40:42,823 --> 00:40:46,348
> was sie in ihrem austauschbaren Wesen ist.
> 
> 676
> 00:40:48,308 --> 00:40:51,328
> Die allgemeine Zeit der menschlichen Nichtentwicklung
> 
> 677
> 00:40:51,489 --> 00:40:54,287
> existiert auch unter dem erg?nzenden Aspekt
> 
> 678
> 00:40:54,498 --> 00:40:56,729
> einer konsumierbaren Zeit, die
> 
> 679
> 00:40:56,859 --> 00:40:58,721
> von dieser bestimmten Produktion aus
> 
> 680
> 00:40:58,883 --> 00:41:01,426
> zum t?glichen Leben der Gesellschaft
> 
> 681
> 00:41:01,638 --> 00:41:04,206
> als eine pseudo-zyklische Zeit zur?ckkehrt.
> 
> 682
> 00:41:04,811 --> 00:41:06,335
> Die pseudozyklische Zeit
> 
> 683
> 00:41:06,497 --> 00:41:09,867
> ist die Zeit des Konsums des modernen ?konomischen ?berlebens,
> 
> 684
> 00:41:10,079 --> 00:41:13,104
> des vermehrten ?berlebens, worin das t?glich Erlebte
> 
> 685
> 00:41:13,229 --> 00:41:16,187
> ohne Entscheidungsgewalt und unterworfen bleibt,
> 
> 686
> 00:41:16,333 --> 00:41:18,215
> aber nicht mehr der nat?rlichen Ordnung,
> 
> 687
> 00:41:18,357 --> 00:41:21,572
> sondern der in der entfremdeten Arbeit entwickelten Pseudonatur;
> 
> 688
> 00:41:21,725 --> 00:41:23,369
> und so findet diese Zeit ganz nat?rlich
> 
> 689
> 00:41:23,510 --> 00:41:26,431
> den alten zyklischen Rhythmus wieder,
> 
> 690
> 00:41:26,544 --> 00:41:30,020
> der das ?berleben der vorindustriellen Gesellschaften regelte.
> 
> 691
> 00:41:30,281 --> 00:41:32,968
> Die pseudozyklische Zeit
> 
> 692
> 00:41:33,210 --> 00:41:36,218
> st?tzt sich auf die ?berreste der zyklischen Zeit
> 
> 693
> 00:41:36,352 --> 00:41:39,725
> und stellt aus ihnen zugleich neue entsprechende Kombinationen her:
> 
> 694
> 00:41:39,871 --> 00:41:41,227
> den Tag und die Nacht,
> 
> 695
> 00:41:41,367 --> 00:41:43,706
> Arbeitswoche und Wochenende,
> 
> 696
> 00:41:43,820 --> 00:41:46,925
> die Wiederkehr der Ferienzeiten.
> 
> 697
> 00:41:47,668 --> 00:41:51,563
> Konsumierbare pseudozyklische Zeit ist spektakul?re Zeit,
> 
> 
> weiter im n0name newsletter #140
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> 2.
> 
> verteidigt das Portal der Fantasie
> 
> (Fortsetzung aus n0name newsletter #138)
> 
> 
> ueber die Zeit als momentaner Entscheidungsfaehigkeit geraet damit von 
> zwei Seiten unter Druck, als kulturindustrielle obszoene Verdichtung 
> von Lebenszeit im inszenierten und gefeierten 'Knueller' und als 
> Instal-lierung eines allgemeinen Zeit- und Oekonomiemaszes, das die 
> mensch-liche Wahrnehmung unterlaeuft.
> Das Zeitverhalten technischer Prozesse ist so beschreibbar: Schon 
> die Einwirkungsgroeszen wie Beobachtung, Kontrolle und Steuerung 
> am Eingang eines durch Apparate vermittelten Vorgangs sind zeitab-
> haengig. Durch den technischen Prozess werden sie umgeformt. Am 
> Ausgang eines wie auch immer gestalteten Maschine / Maschine- oder 
> Mensch / Maschinesystems haben wir es wieder mit zeitabhaengigen Er-
> fahrungsgroeszen zu tun. Solche Prozesse kann man auch dynamische 
> Prozesse nennen. Das mindeste, was Kuenstler und Ingenieure, die in 
> solchen Prozessen engagiert sind, zu tun haben, ist, dafuer zu 
> sorgen, dass die Umformung, die im Mittelteil des Prozesses 
> stattfindet, mar-kante Unterschiede setzt zwischen den 
> Einwirkungsgroeszen am Ein-gang und den Ergebnisgroeszen am Ausgang. 
> Das waere wirksame Arbeit an der Schnittstelle, noch einmal: ihre 
> Dramatisierung. #Gestaltete Zeit muss etwas von der Zeit 
> zurueckgeben koennen, die das Leben den Ein-zelnen gestohlen hat.# 
> Das ist einer der schoensten Gedanken Jean-Luc Godards zum Kino, der 
> sich aber im Hinblick auf die technischen Me-dienwelten erweitern 
> laesst. Schaffen die Medienaktiven die Transfor-mation nicht, ist 
> die prozessierte Zeit vergeudete Zeit. Hinter die Faehig-keiten von 
> Maschinen sollten wir nicht immer wieder zurueckfallen. 
> "Wir irren des Nachts im Kreis umher und werden vom Feuer ver-
> zehrt", so beschrieb der Situationist Guy Debord die Taetigkeit des 
> "Her-umstreunens", die er gegenueber der "Gesellschaft des Spektakels" 
> als einzig wuerdevolle empfand. [23] Die ersten bekannten Zeitmesser 
> der al-ten chinesischen Hochkultur waren labyrinthartig strukturierte, 
> qua-dratische, laengliche oder runde Metallreliefs. In die 
> Auslassungen wurde ein langsam zuendendes Pulver gestreut. Das 
> Verbrennen des Pulvers im Labyrinth zeigte das Vergehen der Zeit an. 
> Debord stellte sei-nen Koerper und seine Einbildungskraft als Material 
> zur Verfuegung fuer die Messung der Zeit, in der er lebte. Was waere 
> die Alternative eines zeitbewussten Handelns gegenueber der 
> situationistischen, sich verzeh-
> 
> 319
> 
> 
> renden Identitaet? Theoretisch koennte sie darin bestehen, Feuer zu 
> sein anstelle des verbrennenden Pulvers. Aber diese Position kann man 
> nur dann einnehmen, wenn man Gott spielen will, da wir ja Teil des 
> Stoffs sind, den die Zeit verbraucht. #Was wir tun koennen, ist, in 
> den Rhyth-mus des Verbrennens, in seine Geschwindigkeit einzugreifen, 
> seine Intervalle mit zu organisieren. Eingreifende Medienpolitik 
> hiesze in die-ser Perspektive aktive Sorge um die Souveraenitaet des 
> Verbrauchs von Zeit und ihrer Organisation. Verlustbereitschaft im 
> Sinne der Verzeh-rung Debords und der Verschwendung Batailles scheint 
> dabei eine not-wendige Voraussetzung zu sein.# #Verlust# ist aber 
> dann keine Kategorie fataler Oekonomie, wenn es gelingt, ihn als 
> #Bereicherung der Anderen# wirksam werden zu lassen. Andernfalls 
> wuerde die Verzehrung religioes, die Verschwendung ideologisch. 
> Und beide Haltungen hatten bereits verheerende Auswirkungen in 
> der juengeren Geschichte. 
> Die Bewegung in die Tiefenzeit medientechnischen Denkens und 
> Operierens hat Protagonisten vorgefuehrt, die in unterschiedlichen 
> his-torischen Konstellationen zur Transformation von Prozessen 
> beitru-gen, indem sie vorhandenes Wissen und Kenntnisse buendelten, 
> er-weiterten, durch ihre Zuspitzungen attraktiv kippen lieszen oder 
> mutig riskantere Wege eroeffneten als diejenigen, die ihnen durch 
> die etablier-ten Verhaeltnisse nahe gelegt wurden. In Anlehnung an 
> eine Bezeich-nung, die Hoelderlin fuer Empedokles erfand, kann man 
> sie auch als Kai-ros-Piloten bezeichnen. In je besonderer Weise 
> haben sie demonstriert, dass der guenstige Moment nicht dazu da 
> ist, um etwas fuer uns zu erle-digen, sondern dass er ergriffen 
> werden muss.
> Die aus Philadelphia stammenden und in London lebenden Zwillinge 
> "The Quay Brothers" inszenieren fuer das Kino und fuer das Theater. 
> Ihre besondere Leidenschaft gilt der Beseelung von toten Materialien 
> durch Techniken des Filmtricks. Nichts anderes bedeutet Animation. 
> Mit einer einzigartigen poetischen Kraft durchstreifen sie in ihren 
> Filmen verges-sene und verdraengte Orte, vornehmlich des oestlichen 
> Mitteleuropa, sammeln Schriftzeichen, Schilder, weggeworfene Dinge, 
> Artefakte, die von einer Resistenz des Alltaeglichen zeugen, Rhythmen 
> und Melodien, die aus Zeitraeumen zu stammen scheinen, zu denen wir 
> den Zugang verloren oder uns verstellt haben. Mit einer 
> unvergleichlichen Sensibi-
> 
> 320
> 
> 
> litaet und virtuosen Praezision animieren sie die Fundstuecke und 
> verbin-den sie mit ihrer Einbildungskraft zu minimalen Orgien 
> augenblick-licher Sensationen. Eine ihrer Bewegungen fuehrte sie 
> durch das ehe-mals zu Polen gehoerende Drohobycz. Eines ihrer fruehen 
> Meisterwerke wurde "Street of Crocodiles" (1985), die eigenwillige 
> filmische Inter-pretation der Kurzgeschichte "Die Krokodilgasse" aus 
> den "Zimtlaeden" von Bruno Schulz. Sie ist filmische Kairos-Poesie 
> _par excellence_. Un-scheinbare Nebenfigur dieses Films ist ein 
> kleiner Junge. In den Hinter-zimmern der von geheimnisvollen 
> Obsessionen, Mannequins und irrer Geschaeftigkeit durchdrungenen 
> Laeden der Krokodilgasse sucht er nach gebautem Material, das seine 
> draengende Neugierde und spielerische Lust befriedigen koennte. 
> Rostige Schrauben winden sich wie von selbst aus schmutzbedeckten 
> Bretterbohlen, wirbeln ueber sie hinweg und dre-hen sich an anderer 
> Stelle wieder elegant in den Boden hinein. Der Junge stoppt die 
> Bewegung einer der Schrauben, dreht sie gegen den Uhrzeigersinn aus 
> dem Boden heraus und fuegt sie sorgfaeltig den uebri-gen lose 
> gesammelten Gegenstaenden hinzu. Eine Figur aus Metallteilen mit 
> einer trueben Gluehbirne als Kopf reibt eine eiserne Platte, die 
> Glimm-draehte in der Birne leuchten kurz auf, der Junge faengt den 
> Lichtstrahl mit einem Taschenspiegel ein und lenkt ihn als 
> Energiebuendel zu einem mechanischen Affen, der sich dafuer mit 
> einem heftigen, sofort wieder abbrechenden Trommelwirbel bedankt. 
> Spaeter sieht man den Jungen mit der metallenen Gluehbirnenfigur an 
> der Seite wieder. Er nimmt sie in den Arm und stuelpt ihr seine 
> Muetze ueber den glaesernen Kopf
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> | #Kuenstlerische Praxis in den Medienwelten ist eine Angele- |
> | genheit der Verschwendung. Ihre privilegierten Orte sind    |
> | nicht Palaeste, sondern offene Laboratorien.#               |
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Medienkunst ist ein seltsames Mixtum compositum. Einerseits bezeich-
> net die Verbindung nahe beieinander Liegendes. Jede kuenstlerische 
> Praxis benoetigt Medien, um fuer andere sinnlich erfahrbar zu werden. 
> Aber Medienkunst ist in den letzten Jahrzehnten auch als ein spezifi-
> sches Konzept kultureller Praxis entwickelt worden. In dieser Perspek-
> 
> 321
> 
> 
> tive enthaelt das Mixtum compositum weit auseinander Klaffendes. Es 
> versucht zwei verschiedene Welten in einer zusammenzufuegen. Diese 
> Verkoppelung hat in ihrem Ursprung auch strategischen Charakter, 
> weniger fuer die Medien als fuer die Kunst. Aehnlich wie zuvor schon 
> bei der _Filmkunst_ oder der _Videokunst_ sollte das Praefix den damit 
> verbunde-nen neuen kuenstlerischen Praxen einerseits eine originelle 
> Absetzung von den traditionellen ermoeglichen, andererseits 
> beinhaltete die Ver-bindung mit der Kunst den Anspruch auf Teilhabe 
> an einem historisch gewordenen Markt, an profilierten Verhaeltnissen 
> der Distribution und des Diskurses. Der strategische Begriff der 
> Medienkunst spitzte dies in-sofern noch zu, als das Praefix _Medien_ 
> spaetestens seit Mitter der 1980er auf eine hohe politische und 
> oekonomische Akzeptanz hoffen durfte. Die Gestaltbarkeit des 
> Zukuenftigen wurde fest an die Medien gebunden. Das war zugleich 
> einer der Gruende, warum die Ablehnung in den tradi-tionellen 
> Institutionen der Kunst viel heftiger ausfiel als bei den vorher-
> gehenden medialen Konzepten.
> Die _Medien_ stehen in der Mischung fuer eine Reihe von Paradigmen, 
> die nicht selbstverstaendlich mit der Kunst verbunden werden. Dazu 
> ge-hoert das Gebot zum grenzenlos Populaeren. Die technischen Medien 
> des ausgehenden 19. und des 20. Jahrhunderts adressierten nicht mehr 
> die geschlossenen Benutzerkreise gesellschaftlicher Elitegruppen, 
> sondern die Moeglichkeit, sozial, regional und national nicht 
> spezifische Publika zu erreichen. Das Telefon, die Telegraphie, das 
> Kino, Radio und Fern-sehen, Videorecorder oder _compact discs_ 
> entstanden als Kulturtechni-ken, die weltweit funktionieren sollten. 
> Die Tendenz zur Ueberschreitung jeglicher Grenzen ist ihnen als 
> Auftrag eingeschrieben. Die telemati-schen Medien verstaerkten diese 
> Tendenz noch einmal. Diejenigen, die sie benutzen, identifizieren 
> sich selbst nicht mehr nur als Zuschauer und Zuhoerer. Vielmehr 
> wurden sie Teilnehmer in einer globalen Veran-staltung, Mitspieler 
> in einem Zusammenhang der Interaktion, den wir Kommunikation zu 
> nennen gelernt haben. In dieser Welt haben wir es nicht mehr nur 
> mit vereinzelten technischen Artefakten zu tun, son-dern mit 
> zusammengesetzten technischen Sachsystemen und, in einem genaueren 
> Sinn des Wortes, mit Technologie. #Es geht nicht mehr ledig-lich 
> um einzelne Vergegenstaendlichungen und Artikulationsformen#
> 
> 322
> 
> ========================================================================
> 
> Sie erhalten den n0name newsletter, weil sie da sind!/You get the
> n0name newsletter, because you are there!
> 
> *Bitte weiterleiten!/Please forward!*
> 
> Archiv: http://www.n0name.de/newsletr.html
> 
> (c) 1999-2009 n0name, die Autorinnen & Autoren und die Maschinen
> 
> Unterstuetzt von XPECT MEDIA http://www.xpect-media.de
> 
> Sponsored by FONDS         Dank an >top e.V.
> 
> ------------------- Ende des n0name newsletter #139 --------------------
> 
> -- 
> Neu: GMX Doppel-FLAT mit Internet-Flatrate + Telefon-Flatrate
> f?r nur 19,99 Euro/mtl.!* http://portal.gmx.net/de/go/dsl02
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
> 


From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 19:19:30 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fr)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 19:19:30 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate]
	=?utf-8?q?=5Bsyndicate_spectre=5D_Abyss=2C_Her_gossam?=
	=?utf-8?b?ZXLigI8=?=
In-Reply-To: <269107.53683.qm@web52404.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <269107.53683.qm@web52404.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4AF31732.8000205@free.fr>

jeff harrison has write access to the list but not read access
who can help ?

Le 05/11/2009 18:48, jeff harrison a ?crit :
> DEAR ADMINS,
> Abyss is amid The Muses; Their faces Her pinions obscure. Can stop move more halt, lyre's silence more hush, Abyss obscure more awful eyes? Always cold and white those orbs when The Muses beheld me. What may Abyss with Her obsidian regard offer me?
>
>
>
>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:<http://tekspost.no/mailman/private/syndicate/attachments/20091105/8deb262f/attachment.html>
> [syndicate spectre]
> we're all admins now that we are
> hosted by http://teks.no
>
>    


From matze.schmidt at n0name.de  Thu Nov  5 20:34:43 2009
From: matze.schmidt at n0name.de (Matze Schmidt)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 20:34:43 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] unsubscribe unsubscire unsubscibe
In-Reply-To: <KSNERS$3D33468A7A4BD11F791B7E56DAA99DB9@libero.it>
References: <KSNERS$3D33468A7A4BD11F791B7E56DAA99DB9@libero.it>
Message-ID: <10310693872.20091105203443@n0name.de>

Hi there,

& there... is it possible to switch to a personal individual daily
digest mode or smth? (Hello, admin?)

Thx and...

best,
Matze

Thursday, November 5, 2009, 7:16:40 PM, you wrote:
> ---------- Initial Header -----------

>>From      : syndicate-bounces at ck13.org
> To          : syndicate at ck13.org
> Cc          : 
> Date      : Mon, 05 Oct 2009 12:04:48 +0200
> Subject : [Syndicate] 0-) n0name nachrichten #139


>> |<------ Breite: 72 Zeichen - Fixed Width Font: Courier New, 10 ------>|
>> 
>> 0-) n0name nachrichten #139 Mi., 03.06.2009 11:06 CET
>> 
>> *Inhalt/Contents*
>> 
>> 1. Debord - La Soci?t? du spectacle.srt als .txt 3
>> 2. verteidigt das Portal der Fantasie
>>    aus: _3000/futuristische Phantasmen und aktuelle Fantasien 
>>    der Technokultur 3.2_ (Fortsetzung aus nn #138)
>> 
>> 32 KB, ca. 19 DIN A4-Seiten
>> 
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> 
>> 1.
>> 
>> Debord - La Soci?t? du spectacle.srt als .txt 3
>> 
>> 
>> 457
>> 00:26:44,877 --> 00:26:46,491
>> Das diffuse Spektakul?re



From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 20:38:00 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fr)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 20:38:00 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] unsubscribe unsubscire unsubscibe
In-Reply-To: <10310693872.20091105203443@n0name.de>
References: <KSNERS$3D33468A7A4BD11F791B7E56DAA99DB9@libero.it>
	<10310693872.20091105203443@n0name.de>
Message-ID: <4AF32998.2060204@free.fr>

short answer: no
just wait 3 days and the next post will be in 3 months

Le 05/11/2009 20:34, Matze Schmidt a ?crit :
> Hi there,
>
> &  there... is it possible to switch to a personal individual daily
> digest mode or smth? (Hello, admin?)
>
> Thx and...
>
> best,
> Matze
>
> Thursday, November 5, 2009, 7:16:40 PM, you wrote:
>    
>> ---------- Initial Header -----------
>>      
>    
>> > From      : syndicate-bounces at ck13.org
>> To          : syndicate at ck13.org
>> Cc          :
>> Date      : Mon, 05 Oct 2009 12:04:48 +0200
>> Subject : [Syndicate] 0-) n0name nachrichten #139
>>      
>
>    
>>> |<------ Breite: 72 Zeichen - Fixed Width Font: Courier New, 10 ------>|
>>>
>>> 0-) n0name nachrichten #139 Mi., 03.06.2009 11:06 CET
>>>
>>> *Inhalt/Contents*
>>>
>>> 1. Debord - La Soci?t? du spectacle.srt als .txt 3
>>> 2. verteidigt das Portal der Fantasie
>>>     aus: _3000/futuristische Phantasmen und aktuelle Fantasien
>>>     der Technokultur 3.2_ (Fortsetzung aus nn #138)
>>>
>>> 32 KB, ca. 19 DIN A4-Seiten
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> 1.
>>>
>>> Debord - La Soci?t? du spectacle.srt als .txt 3
>>>
>>>
>>> 457
>>> 00:26:44,877 -->  00:26:46,491
>>> Das diffuse Spektakul?re
>>>        
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>    


From matze.schmidt at n0name.de  Thu Nov  5 21:21:51 2009
From: matze.schmidt at n0name.de (Matze Schmidt)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 21:21:51 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] unsubscribe unsubscire unsubscibe
In-Reply-To: <4AF32998.2060204@free.fr>
References: <KSNERS$3D33468A7A4BD11F791B7E56DAA99DB9@libero.it>
	<10310693872.20091105203443@n0name.de> <4AF32998.2060204@free.fr>
Message-ID: <153542825.20091105212151@n0name.de>

Okay,

but whatya mean with "the next post will be in 3 months"?
I was just wondering IF the Mailman-man could install the digest mode.
I'm not at all interested in the Spam-discussion or complaning about too
long mailshit.

Thx anyway!

M

Thursday, November 5, 2009, 8:38:00 PM, you wrote:
> short answer: no
> just wait 3 days and the next post will be in 3 months

> Le 05/11/2009 20:34, Matze Schmidt a ?crit :
>> Hi there,
>>
>> &  there... is it possible to switch to a personal individual daily
>> digest mode or smth? (Hello, admin?)
>>
>> Thx and...
>>
>> best,
>> Matze
>>
>> Thursday, November 5, 2009, 7:16:40 PM, you wrote:
>>    
>>> ---------- Initial Header -----------
>>>      
>>    
>>> > From      : syndicate-bounces at ck13.org
>>> To          : syndicate at ck13.org
>>> Cc          :
>>> Date      : Mon, 05 Oct 2009 12:04:48 +0200
>>> Subject : [Syndicate] 0-) n0name nachrichten #139
>>>      
>>
>>    
>>>> |<------ Breite: 72 Zeichen - Fixed Width Font: Courier New, 10 ------>|
>>>>
>>>> 0-) n0name nachrichten #139 Mi., 03.06.2009 11:06 CET
>>>>
>>>> *Inhalt/Contents*
>>>>
>>>> 1. Debord - La Soci?t? du spectacle.srt als .txt 3
>>>> 2. verteidigt das Portal der Fantasie
>>>>     aus: _3000/futuristische Phantasmen und aktuelle Fantasien
>>>>     der Technokultur 3.2_ (Fortsetzung aus nn #138)
>>>>
>>>> 32 KB, ca. 19 DIN A4-Seiten
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> 1.
>>>>
>>>> Debord - La Soci?t? du spectacle.srt als .txt 3
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 457
>>>> 00:26:44,877 -->  00:26:46,491
>>>> Das diffuse Spektakul?re



From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Thu Nov  5 21:28:46 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 22:28:46 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] unsubscribe unsubscire unsubscibe
In-Reply-To: <153542825.20091105212151@n0name.de>
References: <KSNERS$3D33468A7A4BD11F791B7E56DAA99DB9@libero.it>
	<10310693872.20091105203443@n0name.de>
	<4AF32998.2060204@free.fr> <153542825.20091105212151@n0name.de>
Message-ID: <06147E2D-930B-44A1-98C1-105009E2C32F@ggttctttat.com>




you can change your settings as with other mailman lists.
login and set it as you wish

https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate









On Nov 5, 2009, at 10:21 PM, Matze Schmidt wrote:

> Okay,
>
> but whatya mean with "the next post will be in 3 months"?
> I was just wondering IF the Mailman-man could install the digest mode.
> I'm not at all interested in the Spam-discussion or complaning about  
> too
> long mailshit.
>
> Thx anyway!
>
> M


From fmadre at free.fr  Thu Nov  5 21:39:20 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fr)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 21:39:20 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] unsubscribe unsubscire unsubscibe
In-Reply-To: <153542825.20091105212151@n0name.de>
References: <KSNERS$3D33468A7A4BD11F791B7E56DAA99DB9@libero.it>	<10310693872.20091105203443@n0name.de>
	<4AF32998.2060204@free.fr> <153542825.20091105212151@n0name.de>
Message-ID: <4AF337F8.3060606@free.fr>

Le 05/11/2009 21:21, Matze Schmidt a ?crit :
> Okay,
>
> but whatya mean with "the next post will be in 3 months"?
>    
just watch this space.

From gif at 220hex.org  Fri Nov  6 01:27:20 2009
From: gif at 220hex.org (h220)
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2009 01:27:20 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] Piksel09:: call - OPEN WORKSHOPS
Message-ID: <200911060127.21084.gif@220hex.org>

Piksel09 nov. 19-22 2009 
www.piksel.no/p09
==========================
* PIKSEL09 workshop series
* Free and Open Creative Technology workshops 

In connection with the Piksel09 festival we are offering in total 12 electronic 
and software workshops. All the workshops are free to attend, 
but for the hardware workshops we need to charge material costs.

To sign up or get more information, 
please contact us on piksel09 [AT] piksel.no
or register directly at:
http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/schedConf/registration
_______________________________________________________________

*ELECTRONIC WORKSHOPS:

*Tom Bugs (UK): W.O.M (Workshop Osc Machine)*
*Monday 16.11.09**, 12.00-18.00**
- Build your own 3 oscillator one-board synth, DIY kit based 
- No previous experience needed
Material costs: NOK 290,-
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/230

*Diego de Le?n (ES): LP Atari Punk Concole*
*Tuesdag 17.11.09**, 12.00-18.00**
- Learn about the Atari Punk Console circuit and build small noise synth
- No previous experience needed
Material costs:  NOK 290,-
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/90

*Peter Edwards from Casperelectronics (US): DIY Drone Synthesizer
Wednesday 18.11.09***, 12.00-18.00**
- Learn how to build a drone synth using the Drone Lab Kit.
Material costs: NOK 850,-
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/231

*Hackteria: Bioelectronics for artists
**Thursday 19.11.09 - Saturday 21.11.09***, 12.00-18.00**
- A three day workshop giving the participants an introduction to microscopy 
and tools for interfacing with micro organisms.
Material costs:  NOK 210,-
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/94

*Andy Bolus: Building simple analogue light-controlled theremins
**Sunday 22.11.09***, 12.00-18.00**
- learn how to build a simple, analogue theremin, controlled by light sensors.
Material costs: NOK 210,-
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/180

*Arjan Scherpenisse: VGA Signals**
Sunday 22.11.09***, 12.00-18.00**
- Learn how to make a simple micro-controller to generate signals 
for displaying pixel patterns on any VGA monitor or beamer. 
Material costs: NOK 165,-
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/65

*Minia: Open Hardware Sensor Board*
*Monday 23.11.09 - Tuesday 24.11.09***, 12.00-18.00**
- Learn how to use MINIA - a USB, plug and play multi platform device 
that translates external sensor data to the computer.
Material costs: NOK 165,-
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/229

*
SOFTWARE WORKSHOPS

Luca Carrubba (IT): Qeve - Free your visuals*
*Thursday 19.11.09***, 11.00-13.00**
- Learn how to use Qeve, a free software tool for video improvisation 
and partake in a joint video streaming session.
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/210

*Glerm Soares (BR): Navalha 
- handcrafted hardware/software audio performance interface
*Friday 20.11.09***, 11.00-13.00**
- Learn how to use Navalha - an software/hardware interface 
for real-time slicing of audio files.
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/212

*Alexandre Quessy: ToonLoop Live Animation workshop
*Saturday 21.11.09***, 11.00-13.00**
- Learn how to use ToonLoop - a real time stop motion animation tool. 
- Bring your own computer and midi controllers!
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/137

*Yves Degoyon (ES): Open Computer Vision
*Sunday 22.11.09***, 11.00-13.00**
- Get an introduction to Open Computer Vision (based on PureData), 
current libraries and the openCV API. 
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/69

*SPECIAL EVENT:

**Chaoslab: Random evolution & aperiodic bifurcation workshop
**Friday 20.11.09 - Saturday 21.11.09***, 12.00-18.00**
- Partake in an experiment based on chaotic systems and indeterminism 
in a workshop environment of participant sensitive equipment.
MORE: http://piksel.no/ocs/index.php/piksel/piksel09/paper/view/158
_______________________________________________________________

Piksel09 is supported by The Norwegian Art Council, Bergen Municipality, 
Hordaland County Council, Nordic Culture Fund, PNEK, BKK and OCA.

For more information: http://www.piksel.no/p09 -> http://www.piksel.no/

-------------------------------------------------------
--

From jp_halgand at pavu.com  Thu Nov  5 09:28:56 2009
From: jp_halgand at pavu.com (jp halgand - pavu.com)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 09:28:56 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] ok now
Message-ID: <C4849977-CE31-46D4-80A2-895C744E242B@pavu.com>

ah!
birds anywhere?

cuicuiing?



From choubard at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 11:09:14 2009
From: choubard at gmail.com (Choubard)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 11:09:14 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] [syndicate spectre] good bye
In-Reply-To: <375642998.1529911257414694222.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
References: <375642998.1529911257414694222.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
Message-ID: <2BE3867B-F170-4438-90B8-D649D1B54E57@gmail.com>

Je suis indisponible a 12h pour une demi heure

Le 5 nov. 2009 ? 10:51, fm <fmadre at free.fr> a ?crit :

> DEAR ADMINS,
> dear admins
> you are dead
>
> [syndicate spectre] list run by n2o at ggttctttat.com
>
> [syndicate spectre]
> we're all admins now that we are
> hosted by http://teks.no

From ctgr at free.fr  Fri Nov  6 12:01:12 2009
From: ctgr at free.fr (ctgr)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 12:01:12 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] ok now
In-Reply-To: <C4849977-CE31-46D4-80A2-895C744E242B@pavu.com>
References: <C4849977-CE31-46D4-80A2-895C744E242B@pavu.com>
Message-ID: <C03C663A-BCBE-4720-A6C0-3C2010A76E1B@free.fr>

ah!
can you seed  ?

cocotting ?

Le 5 nov. 09 ? 09:28, jp halgand - pavu.com a ?crit :

> ah!
> birds anywhere?
>
> cuicuiing?
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>


From thth at noos.fr  Fri Nov  6 13:06:43 2009
From: thth at noos.fr (TH)
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2009 13:06:43 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] test
In-Reply-To: <4AF337F8.3060606@free.fr>
References: <KSNERS$3D33468A7A4BD11F791B7E56DAA99DB9@libero.it>	<10310693872.20091105203443@n0name.de>	<4AF32998.2060204@free.fr>
	<153542825.20091105212151@n0name.de> <4AF337F8.3060606@free.fr>
Message-ID: <4AF41153.9000906@noos.fr>

OK

From jp_halgand at pavu.com  Fri Nov  6 13:16:55 2009
From: jp_halgand at pavu.com (jp halgand - pavu.com)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 13:16:55 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] [syndicate spectre] good bye
In-Reply-To: <2BE3867B-F170-4438-90B8-D649D1B54E57@gmail.com>
References: <375642998.1529911257414694222.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
	<2BE3867B-F170-4438-90B8-D649D1B54E57@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <45E147DA-C599-4877-8E2C-817245F533C3@pavu.com>


ach ich confirme que t'as toujours pas compris sur quelle liste du bist
aber du kanst be indisponible ion syndicate f?r 12 jahren, No ?


> Je suis indisponible a 12h pour une demi heure
>
> Le 5 nov. 2009 ? 10:51, fm <fmadre at free.fr> a ?crit :
>
>> DEAR ADMINS,
>> dear admins
>> you are dead
>>
>> [syndicate spectre] list run by n2o at ggttctttat.com
>>
>> [syndicate spectre]
>> we're all admins now that we are
>> hosted by http://teks.no
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate


From jp_halgand at pavu.com  Fri Nov  6 13:18:09 2009
From: jp_halgand at pavu.com (jp halgand - pavu.com)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 13:18:09 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] ok now
In-Reply-To: <C03C663A-BCBE-4720-A6C0-3C2010A76E1B@free.fr>
References: <C4849977-CE31-46D4-80A2-895C744E242B@pavu.com>
	<C03C663A-BCBE-4720-A6C0-3C2010A76E1B@free.fr>
Message-ID: <264AA443-43AD-4C9D-AB79-D8DEE17C7E4D@pavu.com>

Jah!

seeding pepites

but first going mountain tops!

> ah!
> can you seed  ?
>
> cocotting ?
>
> Le 5 nov. 09 ? 09:28, jp halgand - pavu.com a ?crit :
>
>> ah!
>> birds anywhere?
>>
>> cuicuiing?
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate


From fmadre at free.fr  Fri Nov  6 13:22:36 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 13:22:36 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] ok now
In-Reply-To: <264AA443-43AD-4C9D-AB79-D8DEE17C7E4D@pavu.com>
Message-ID: <1492185572.1735541257510156462.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

gut: how many uns*bscribers today mein general ?

----- Mail Original -----
De: "jp halgand - pavu.com" <jp_halgand at pavu.com>
?: "SYNDICATE ||" <syndicate at ck13.org>
Envoy?: Vendredi 6 Novembre 2009 13h18:09 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: Re: [Syndicate] ok now

Jah!

seeding pepites

but first going mountain tops!

> ah!
> can you seed  ?
>
> cocotting ?
>
> Le 5 nov. 09 ? 09:28, jp halgand - pavu.com a ?crit :
>
>> ah!
>> birds anywhere?
>>
>> cuicuiing?
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate

_______________________________________________
Syndicate mailing list
Syndicate at ck13.org
https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate

From thth at noos.fr  Fri Nov  6 13:29:49 2009
From: thth at noos.fr (TH)
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2009 13:29:49 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] "HADOPI"
Message-ID: <4AF416BD.2000301@noos.fr>

"La bataille HADOPI"

"Bonjour,

jeudi 29 octobre, sortie du livre collectif
"la bataille HADOPI" en licences copyleft
CC by+sa et Licence Art Libre.
Au Fouquet's de 18h ? 20h.
http://www.inlibroveritas.net/la-bataille-hadopi.html "

OK mais pourquoi le Fouquet's ????
ce n'est pas tr?s judicieux de choisir un lieu pareil
chic et "sarkoziste" de merde

soyez un peu plus malin

ben w? le "Fouquet's" ???!!!!

c de la daube ce lieu
faire ?? au Fouquet's
PFFF !!! (bis)

c la loose direct la Bataille

ils n'assurent pas en com'
et ?v?nementiel l?...

par contre ?? ? la Maison des M?tallos

ct tout bon/

j'ai mes entr?es, je bosse pour eux.

stay tuned.

ROBBY aka THTH

Ps j'ai vraiment du mal avec les listes dites politiques
mod?r?es (...) cf nettime france

vive SYNDICATE 2 !!!!
http://tekspost.no/mailman/admindb/syndicate

PS ce message passe sur le SDH & olalaparis
3700 abonn?s

et pas mal de monde en Cci
* spam machine mode on *

RAPPEL _

- POWER ROBOT : "re : Rejet de votre message"

- ROBBY : ARE YOU SPAMMING TO ME ?

BONUS ET RABE_

"Bonjour,

J'ai appris quelque chose d'assez hallucinant aujourd'hui. Hadopi et
m?me Loppsi ne sont vraisemblablement que des mises en bouche.

A lire ici :
http://fr.readwriteweb.com/2009/11/04/a-la-une/dictature-20-think-global-act-local/ 


Ma r?action perso figure dans les commentaires, sous le pseudonyme
U.H.M., et ci-dessous. Elle est ?pidermique, mais d'une grande sinc?rit?.

Plut?t que de parler "d'identit? nationale", cet esp?ce d'?norme
attrape-couillon aussi p?tainiste qu'?lectoraliste, il faudrait parler
de cette guerre virtuelle ? venir.

This time, it's war.
---------------------------------

U.H.M.
05 novembre 2009 ? 13:53

Bien? Les lois IPRED, HADOPI et le projet LOPPSI, apr?s la loi DADVSI,
la Directive Europ?enne sur le droit d?auteur et la l?gis?la?tion
am??ri?caine du DMCA, n??taient que des pr??mices. Ce projet de trait?,
qui ent??rine en r?a?lit? la confis?ca?tion finale du droit d?auteur par
les ?diteurs et indus?tries cultu?relles, consti?tue le vais?seau amiral.

Il a pour but de ver?rouiller les grands mono?poles capi?ta?lis?tiques
au d?tri?ment de la pro?pa?ga?tion de la culture, en oubliant que la
propagation de la culture est la condition de base pour toute forme de
cr?ation intellectuelle. Il a pour but d??tendre le bio?con?tr?le ?
inter?net, de mettre fin ? la neu?tra?lit? tech?no?lo?gique du r?seau.
Il a pour but de qua?driller le monde vir?tuel pour y pro?lon?ger la
domi?na?tion des oli?garques qui pr??sident d?j?, dans le monde
tan?gible, ? la pro?duc?tion du sens et des contenus.

Souches g?n??tiques, obten?tions v?g??tales, cr?a?tions artis?tiques,
d?ve?lop?pe?ments logi?ciels, inven?tions scientifiques, res?sources
agroa?li?men?taires, tout doit aujourd?hui ?tre sou?mis ? leurs bre?vets
et leurs cata?logues. La recherche scientifique doit ?tre mise au pas :
on abandonne la recherche fondamentale pour donner la prime aux travaux
sectoriels, plus rentables. Idem dans l'industrie pharmaceutique, o? la
priorit? est donn?e aux travaux rentables, tant pis pour les malades.
Quant ? nos forces de travail, elle sont notre indice boursier : nous ne
valons que par elles. Nous sommes de la main-d'oeuvre, des c??ts de
production. Car en cela r?sident les soci??t?s de contr?le : de notre
ADN ? notre patri?moine mat??riel, de notre vie pri?v?e ? nos id?es
poli?tiques, nos modes de vies et nos lec?tures, de nos savoir-faire
professionnels ? nos loisirs et nos inclinations, tout doit ?tre
arrai?sonn? par leurs logiques consu?m??ristes, ren?ta?bi?listes et
d?s?in?car?n?es. L?hypermassification mar?chande, ani?m?e par le
mar?ke?ting intru?sif et la r?pres?sion judi?ciaire, veut cap?tu?rer
l?int?gralit? du vivant dans une dys?to?pie tota?li?taire ?crasante.

Et pour?tant, il est clair que m?me ? un niveau bas?se?ment ?cono?mique,
les logiques pro?pri??taires de ces indus?tries vont pure?ment et
sim?ple?ment mou?rir. Les grands mono?poles des indus?tries
cultu?relles, logi?cielles, phar?ma?ceu?tiques, etc.. devront ?tre
rame?n?s ? des dimen?sions humaines, ou alors dis?pa?ra?tre. Ce sont des
dino?saures concep?tuels qui se battent pour pr??ser?ver leurs
mono?poles, que ni la pro?tec?tion de la cr?a?tion ni l?int?r?t g?n??ral
ne jus?ti?fient aujourd?hui.

En France, la n?oa?ris?to?cra?tie politico-m?diacratique a clai?re?ment
d?clar? la guerre ? inter?net, en l?accusant de tous les maux. Les
r?els, et les ima?gi?naires. Criminaliser la contes?ta?tion civile en la
taxant de ?ter?ro?risme?, voil? ce qui consti?tue le pro?gramme de nos
poli?tiques en mati?re d?internet.L?ex?cutif actuel a la main-mise sur
les grands m?dias clas?siques, qui s?autocensurent en fonc?tion des
ami?ti?s du roi?te?let du Fouquet?s. L?opposition poli?tique est
exsangue, elle se cherche, elle n?existe pas r?el?le?ment. Le der?nier
espace de contes?ta?tion et par cons??quent de libert?, il est ici, sur
le net???mal?gr? toutes ses propres d?rives orwel?liennes, ses scories
ignobles (int?gristes, x?nophobes, n?gationnistes, p?dophiles ou
terroristes), sans oublier sa plate fri?vo?lit? socialisante et son
conformisme gr?gaire.

Ces poli?ti?cards fran?ais, ivres de leur pou?voir pseudo-d?mocratique,
vou?draient cri?mi?na?li?ser inter?net ? Nous mettre au pas ? coups
d?Hadopi et de Loppsi ? Ils ne vont pas ?tre d??us? Les Nicolas Sarkozy,
Brice Hortefeux, Patrick Devedjian, Alain Finkielkraut, Jean-Fran?ois
Cop?, Eric Raoult, Philippe Val, Nadine Morano, Christophe Lameign?re,
Henri Guaino et Claude Gu?ant, Fr?d?ric Lefebvre, Denis Olivennes,
Pascal N?gre, Jacques S?gu?la, tous ces petits marquis, tous ces
d?ten?teurs oli?gar?chiques des pou?voirs poli?tique, m?dia?tique et
cultu?rel, toutes ces ordures qui fus?tigent la libert? d?internet,
seront encore vic?times de notre libert? dans 10 ou 20 ans.

Leur potentat aristocratique, qui ne se caract?rise que par son
client?lisme affairiste, sa corruption end?mique, son n?potisme
d?plorable, et son autoritarisme corporatiste, nous ?crase de tout son
poids. Les banques, les multinationales, les grands m?dias, les
complexes militaro-industriels, les troisi?mes couteaux qui grouillent
dans les minist?res et les conseils d'administration, r?gissent nos vies
jusque dans les derniers d?tails. Ces cloportes usurpent les principes
d?mocratiques et violent nos droits, sous pr?texte d'assurer notre
comp?titivit? collective et notre s?curit? individuelle. La "gauche"
n'est que le cadavre d'un tra?tre en phase de d?composition, il ne faut
plus compter sur elle pour prot?ger les libert?s (publiques ou
individuelles). Il ne faut plus compter sur elle pour d?finir d'autre
?lan civilisationnel que la gestion de l'existant, le management du
risque, le marketing public.

Mais leur b?tise sys?t??mique sera d?non?c?e par nos mani?festes
poli?tiques et nos actions ?ter?ro?ristes?. Leur fichage g?n??ra?lis?
sera an?anti par nos mal?ver?sa?tions infor?ma?tiques et nos
d?tour?ne?ments g?n?tiques. Ils n?ont pas la moindre chance, nous sommes
l?gion. Ils ont le droit, nous avons la tech?nique. Ils ont les
fron?ti?res ?triqu?es de leurs cer?velles archa?ques, nous avons le
monde ? por?t?e de clic.

Ce projet de Trait? montre en tous cas, si besoin ?tait encore, que
l?Oligarchie est mon?diale. Elle n?est pas que le fait des Copains du
Fouquet?s, elle est le fait des indus?tries du Kapitalisme de 4e esp?ce,
au pre?mier range desquelles les indus?tries dites ?cultu?relles?. La
ligne de front va ?tre bien plus glo?bale que pr?vu, mal?gr? les
aver?tis?se?ments d??conomistes aussi ?minents que Joseph Stiglitz ou
Paul Krugman.

Cette fois, c?est la guerre.

Si un tel Trait? devait entrer en vigueur (apr?s j?imagine une longue
guerre de tran?ch?es et des mani?pu?la?tions ? n?en plus finir ? c?t?
desquelles les mal?ver?sa?tions de la France contre l?amendement Bono
inclus dans le Paquet T?l?com, para??tront des enfan?tillages), alors il
convien?dra d?en prendre acte. De prendre acte que les ?lites
diri?geantes de la sph?re capi?ta?liste nous d?clarent une guerre sans
merci aux fins de r?i?fi?ca?tion int??grale du vivant.

Et de d?cla?rer tr?s clai?re?ment que, puisque l?Oligarchie qui pr??side
? la pro?duc?tion des normes juri?diques a d?cid? de prendre en otage la
cr?a?tion artis?tique pour d?fendre ses mono?poles et ?tendre son
contr?le, nous n?observerons plus aucune de leurs lois. Face au Grand
March? et ? ses ver?rous l?gis?la?tifs, nous oppo?se?rons la ma??trise
tech?nique des r?seaux, et les tac?tiques insur?rec?tion?nelles
n?ces?saires au dyna?mi?tage de leurs mono?poles. Face ? la
stan?dar?di?sa?tion payante et ? la confis?ca?tion bio?po?li?tique, nous
oppo?se?rons nos uto?pies pri?v?es et cryp?t?es, nos r?seaux invi?sibles
et nos actions de r?sistance.

Les soci??t?s de contr?le explo?se?ront de l?int?rieur. Nous y
veille?rons. Et les petits marquis qui se met?tront en tra?vers de nos
routes le paie?ront au prix fort.

Cette fois, c?est la guerre.

From info at furtherfield.org  Fri Nov  6 16:26:33 2009
From: info at furtherfield.org (info)
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2009 15:26:33 +0000
Subject: [Syndicate] Artivistic: TURN*ON
Message-ID: <4AF44029.6060204@furtherfield.org>

Sorry for any cross posting...

Artivistic: TURN*ON

Reviewed by Gabriel Menotti on Furtherfield.

This year's edition of Artivistic (Montreal 15-17 October), brings the 
fields of art, politics and academia together under the theme of TURN*ON 
- according to its curatorial statement, 'a fragile bridge extending, 
over a valley of which the depth you cannot see, to a life centered on 
pleasure, consciousness, togetherness, understanding, and joy'.

http://www.furtherfield.org/displayreview.php?review_id=363

Artivistic is an international transdisciplinary three-day gathering on 
the interPlay between art, information and activism. Artivistic emerges 
out of the proposition that not only artists talk about art, academics 
about theory, and activists about activism. Founded in 2004, the event 
aims to promote transdisciplinary and intercultural dialogue on activist 
art beyond critique, to create and facilitate a network of diverse 
peoples, and to inspire, proliferate, activate.

Gabriel Menotti (Brazil, 1983) is an independent curator and producer 
engaged with emerging media circuits. He has been involved with pirate 
movie screenings, remix film festivals, videogame championships, porn 
screenplay workshops, installations with super8 film projectors and 
generative art exhibitions. Currently, he is a PhD candidate at 
Goldsmiths (University London).


Other Info:

A living, breathing, thriving networked neighbourhood...

We are on Twitter
http://twitter.com/furtherfield

Other reviews/articles/interviews
http://www.furtherfield.org/reviews.php

Furtherfield - online media arts community, platforms for creating,
viewing, discussing and learning about experimental practices at the
intersections of art, technology and social change.
http://www.furtherfield.org

HTTP Gallery - physical media arts Gallery (London).
http://www.http.uk.net

Netbehaviour - an open email list community engaged in the process of
sharing and actively evolving critical approaches, methods and ideas
focused around contemporary networked media arts practice.
http://www.netbehaviour.org

Furtherfield Blog - shared space for personal reflections on media art
practice.
http://blog.furtherfield.org

VisitorsStudio - real-time, multi-user, online arena for creative 'many
to many' dialogue, networked performance and collaborative polemic.
http://www.visitorsstudio.org/x.html

Furthernoise -  an online platform for the creation, promotion,
criticism and archiving of innovative cross genre music and sound art
for the information & interaction of the public and artists alike.
http://www.furthernoise.org


From fmadre at free.fr  Fri Nov  6 16:28:15 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 16:28:15 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] Artivistic: TURN*ON
In-Reply-To: <4AF44029.6060204@furtherfield.org>
Message-ID: <1757268296.1769561257521295210.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

> Sorry for any cross posting...

not seen any good ones lately

f.

From fmadre at free.fr  Fri Nov  6 16:33:37 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 16:33:37 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] please
Message-ID: <1679664791.1770661257521617493.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

learn your history
http://www.pairlist.net/pipermail/palais-tokyo/Week-of-Mon-20000424/001478.html

From marc.garrett at furtherfield.org  Fri Nov  6 16:36:37 2009
From: marc.garrett at furtherfield.org (marc garrett)
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2009 15:36:37 +0000
Subject: [Syndicate] Artivistic: TURN*ON
In-Reply-To: <1757268296.1769561257521295210.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
References: <1757268296.1769561257521295210.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
Message-ID: <4AF44285.10706@furtherfield.org>

have you been looking ?

m
>> Sorry for any cross posting...
>>     
>
> not seen any good ones lately
>
> f.
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>   


From fmadre at free.fr  Fri Nov  6 16:38:17 2009
From: fmadre at free.fr (fm)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 16:38:17 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Syndicate] Artivistic: TURN*ON
In-Reply-To: <4AF44285.10706@furtherfield.org>
Message-ID: <1362893332.1771511257521897679.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>

you got me there
where else do you send this ?

----- Mail Original -----
De: "marc garrett" <marc.garrett at furtherfield.org>
?: "SYNDICATE ||" <syndicate at ck13.org>
Envoy?: Vendredi 6 Novembre 2009 16h36:37 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: Re: [Syndicate] Artivistic: TURN*ON

have you been looking ?

m
>> Sorry for any cross posting...
>>     
>
> not seen any good ones lately
>
> f.
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>   

_______________________________________________
Syndicate mailing list
Syndicate at ck13.org
https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate

From marc.garrett at furtherfield.org  Fri Nov  6 16:41:04 2009
From: marc.garrett at furtherfield.org (marc garrett)
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2009 15:41:04 +0000
Subject: [Syndicate] Artivistic: TURN*ON
In-Reply-To: <1362893332.1771511257521897679.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
References: <1362893332.1771511257521897679.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
Message-ID: <4AF44390.2090201@furtherfield.org>

depends really - whoever will allow us to share info...

m.

 > you got me there
 > where else do you send this ?
 >
 > ----- Mail Original -----
 > De: "marc garrett" <marc.garrett at furtherfield.org>
 > ?: "SYNDICATE ||" <syndicate at ck13.org>
 > Envoy?: Vendredi 6 Novembre 2009 16h36:37 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / 
Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
 > Objet: Re: [Syndicate] Artivistic: TURN*ON
 >
 > have you been looking ?
 >
 > m
 >>> Sorry for any cross posting...
 >>>     
 >> not seen any good ones lately
 >>
 >> f.
 >> _______________________________________________
 >> Syndicate mailing list
 >> Syndicate at ck13.org
 >> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
 >>
 >>   
 >
 > _______________________________________________
 > Syndicate mailing list
 > Syndicate at ck13.org
 > https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
 > _______________________________________________
 > Syndicate mailing list
 > Syndicate at ck13.org
 > https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate


From aart at eunet.rs  Fri Nov  6 15:36:01 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 15:36:01 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] test
References: <KSNERS$3D33468A7A4BD11F791B7E56DAA99DB9@libero.it>	<10310693872.20091105203443@n0name.de>	<4AF32998.2060204@free.fr><153542825.20091105212151@n0name.de>
	<4AF337F8.3060606@free.fr> <4AF41153.9000906@noos.fr>
Message-ID: <02E9B8D8E35B4D9CBB0C99BA2AEAABF7@desktoppc>


Andrej Tisma -  artist, art critic and  curator
WEBSITE: http://www.atisma.com/ 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "TH" <thth at noos.fr>
To: "SYNDICATE ||" <syndicate at ck13.org>
Sent: Friday, November 06, 2009 1:06 PM
Subject: [Syndicate] test


> OK
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate

From guibertc at criticalsecret.com  Fri Nov  6 18:16:34 2009
From: guibertc at criticalsecret.com (Aliette Guibert-Certhoux)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 18:16:34 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] test
In-Reply-To: <4AF41153.9000906@noos.fr>
References: <KSNERS$3D33468A7A4BD11F791B7E56DAA99DB9@libero.it>
	<10310693872.20091105203443@n0name.de> <4AF32998.2060204@free.fr>
	<153542825.20091105212151@n0name.de> <4AF337F8.3060606@free.fr>
	<4AF41153.9000906@noos.fr>
Message-ID: <9eb0e3810911060916v7a583948t62fec0ee19ec1216@mail.gmail.com>

me concernant ?a marche pour les autres -- que je re?ois -- mais pas
pour la r?ception de mes propres posts ;
?a doit ?tre encore ? cause de gmail, il faudra que je "check" mes
emails depuis mon ancien ordinateur o? j'ai laiss? les logiciels.

On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 1:06 PM, TH <thth at noos.fr> wrote:
> OK
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>

From aart at eunet.rs  Fri Nov  6 19:25:59 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 19:25:59 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] test 2
Message-ID: <7936BBFA137B4FCC90B3BD9CDE76BE0D@desktoppc>

sorry, must test once again

From guibertc at criticalsecret.com  Mon Nov  9 05:57:23 2009
From: guibertc at criticalsecret.com (Aliette Guibert C.)
Date: Mon, 09 Nov 2009 05:57:23 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] Mort de Jacno / R.I.P. JACNO
Message-ID: <4AF7A133.9080007@criticalsecret.com>

http://translate.google.com/#

Vendredi en d?but de soir?e commen?aient les deux jours de Polyphonix 
http://www.polyphonix.org/ au Peuple qui manque 
http://www.lepeuplequimanque.org/ inaugur?s par un film de Jean-Pierre 
Sergent sur Jacqueline Cahen, po?te amie qui ? plusieurs reprises avait 
aussi contribu? ? criticalsecret, disparue au d?but de cette ann?e, des 
suites d'un cancer. Contre mon intention je n'ai pu m'y rendre, accabl?e 
d'angoisse. Vers neuf heures il fallait bien sortir un peu.. je me suis 
laiss?e faire. L'id?e ?tait d'aller en voiture jusqu'au carrefour 
Mabillon, parce que ces jours-ci nous pensions, mais plut?t ? Chtcheglov 
qu'? Perec, nous disant au fond que le d?fi concurrentiel que Debord lui 
avait lanc?, le poussant dans ses engagements extr?mes, l'avait 
"poignard?" deux fois. Une fois en rompant avec lui faute de le 
soumettre, une fois en renouant avec lui dans les conditions o?, depuis, 
il ?tait enferm? ? l'hopital psychiatrique, parce que sa compagne crut 
qu'il allait faire sauter la Tour Eiffel (du moins ?tait-ce l'intention 
d?clar?e "historiquement" par les responsables de son internement qui 
passera ? la post?rit? des pertes et profits des po?tes psychiatris?s), 
au moment o? l'?trange patient reprenait la plume pour ?crire son 
autobiographie, dans une d?rive fragment?e de l'?criture, ce qui 
int?ressa Debord, pas seulement pour des raisons magnanimes, peut-on 
supposer. Lorsque Chtcheglov arriva justement au point de r?actualiser 
la blessure survenue lors de leur rupture, il perdit la coordination de 
sa main, et sans doute n'?crivit-il plus jamais... Voir si la pergola de 
l'ancien caf? ?ponyme ?tait toujours en place au dessus de la boutique 
qui l'avait remplac? en fa?ade d'angle de l'immeuble, au bout de la rue 
du four. Il y allait souvent, d'apr?s sa m?re, si on lit bien 
Apostolid?s chez Allia... La pergola est toujours l?, prot?geant la 
courbe de la baie de la vitrine, d'une boutique de v?tement. C'est au 
retour, en ?coutant la radio, que nous avons appris la mort de Jacno, un 
autre ami devenu lointain, mais toujours aim?.

La nouvelle catastrophe, c'?tait ?a. Voici l'hommage ? Jacno dans un 
articl? informant de la mort, d?di? ? La revue des ressources,
plac? en ?dito du 8 novembre par Robin Hunzinger :

MORT DE JACNO
http://www.larevuedesressources.org/spip.php?article1405

Pour m?moire d'enfances et d'adolescences, Jacno ? 23 ans, en 1980, 
cartonne avec Rectangle, sur trois doigts...
Rectangle, extrait de l'album JACNO, 1979 (clip du Single pour une 
?mission TV)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fTe0xaJ6Ac


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacno
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stinky_toys

From Andrej.Savski at guest.arnes.si  Mon Nov  9 10:02:52 2009
From: Andrej.Savski at guest.arnes.si (andrej savski)
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 10:02:52 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] unsuscribe
Message-ID: <82668B6EFD9C4404991462C81F6C513A@gajba>

unsuscribe please, thank you.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091109/f90dff60/attachment.htm>

From evh_transcribe at yahoo.com  Mon Nov  9 14:01:36 2009
From: evh_transcribe at yahoo.com (Eric van Hove)
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 05:01:36 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Syndicate] unsuscribe
In-Reply-To: <82668B6EFD9C4404991462C81F6C513A@gajba>
References: <82668B6EFD9C4404991462C81F6C513A@gajba>
Message-ID: <552620.76393.qm@web53005.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

unsuscribe please, thank you.


      New Email names for you! 
Get the Email name you&#39;ve always wanted on the new @ymail and @rocketmail. 
Hurry before someone else does!
http://mail.promotions.yahoo.com/newdomains/aa/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091109/188d6dc6/attachment-0001.htm>

From gif at 220hex.org  Mon Nov  9 20:58:06 2009
From: gif at 220hex.org (h220)
Date: Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:58:06 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] Piksel09 :: f[re](e){op}[en]able - 19-22 november 2009
Message-ID: <200911092058.06651.gif@220hex.org>

Piksel09 :: f[re](e){op}[en]able

[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
 Piksel09 :: festival
 November 19-22 2009

 Piksel09 :: exhibition
 Nov. 20/09 - Jan. 10/10
[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]

We are also changing the world!

- the 7th annual Piksel festival for 
- Electronic Art and Technological Freedom is on! 
- in Bergen, Norway

--->   Get inspired by Exhibitions
--->   Get amazed by LIVEart performances
--->   Get wiser through Seminars
--->   Get sustained by Workshops

Biohacking, DIY Electronics, open hardware, free software, circuit 
bending, process art, computer vision, multitouch, noise, 
alternative interfaces, live animation, sound art, light installation, 
LED art, code poetry, VGA hacking
___________________________________________________________________

Programme:

EXHIBITIONS @ Galleri 3,14, Lydgalleriet --
http://piksel.no/p09/_exhibition

David Elliott, Pall Thayer, Paul Klotz, Andreas Muxel, Martin Hesselmeier, 
Susanna Katharina Hertrich, Marie-Julie Bourgeois, Michael Day, Arjan 
Scherpenisse, Ben Woodeson, Angie Atmadjaja, Gijs Gieskes, Carlos Tricas, 
Wolfgang Spahn, Thomas Gerwin, Ricardo Oliveira Nascimento,Ebru Kurbak, 
Fabiana Shizue, Dream Addictive, Carmen Gonz?lez, Leslie Garc?a, Arnfinn 
Killingtveit, Wendy Ann Mansilla, Jordi Puig


PRESENTATIONS @ Bergen Kunstmuseum/Stenersen --
http://piksel.no/p09/Presentations

ToonLoop, Virtual Entity, REBUNTU, The Art of Seduction OR Practical Jedi 
Mindtricks OR Escaping the Matrix, Microcodes, Re-ware, Milkymist, Noise & 
Capitalism, Open Source Software Tools for creativity, Pure Data Rhythm & Bass 
Machine, Gate peepin?, The Hijmans van den Bergh building installation, OHANDA 
? Open Hardware and Design Alliance, Flock, _oneliner, Respirator, Py-Cessing, 
APODIO, Multi-Touch 360, Open Artistic Production


LIVE PERFORMANCES @ Landmark, T?rnsalen & N?steBoden --
http://piksel.no/p09/live-events

Action Potential, KUNST UND MUSIK MIT DEM TAGESLICHTPROJEKTOR, Noise invaders, 
DC12V ::Teatrino Elettrico::, Paper Cut Tales, Colour Projections, Mouth(s)? 
lecture(s), Mattin, d.R.e.G.S., noish_VS_automata, Souffles I, He boxed 
regularly and was strong and very brave and always a perfect gentleman, 
Psychoid, MSST, Andy Bolus, The DIY drone synthesizer, Respirator, [i/o], 
THENOISER VS ZERO POINT ENERGY

WORKSHOPS @ N?stegate 42 & PikselHut --
http://piksel.no/p09/Workshops

W.O.M. ? Workshop Osc Machine, LP Atari Punk Console, The DIY drone 
synthesizer, Qeve ? Free your visuals, Hackteria | bioelectronix for artists, 
Navalha ? handcrafted hardware/software audio performance interface, CHAOSLAB, 
ToonLoop Live Animation Workshop, Enhancing Pure Data Interactivity with 
Computer Vision (Open CV), Building simple analogue light-controlled 
theremins, VGA Signals: an introduction

--

more info and complete programme:
http://piksel.no/p09
_______________________________________________________________

Piksel09 is supported by The Norwegian Art Council, Bergen Municipality, 
Hordaland County Council, Nordic Culture Fund, Nordic Cultur Point, PNEK, BKK 
and OCA.

OUTRO STREAM: FREE AS IN ART!
--------------------------------------------------
Piksel is an international event for artists and developers working with
Free/Libre and Open Source technologies in artistic practice.
Part workshop, part festival, it is organised in Bergen, Norway, and 
involves participants from more than a dozen countries exchanging ideas, 
coding, presenting art and software projects, doing workshops, performances 
and discussions on the aesthetics and politics of FLOSS & art.
--------------------------------------------------

BLOG www.piksel.no
TECH www.piksel.org
WIKI   www.piksel.no/pwiki
IRC    #piksel (irc.freenode.net)
LISTS www.piksel.no/pwiki/MailingLists

-----

From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Thu Nov 12 15:25:36 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 2009 16:25:36 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] IMSTA - Regarding one of your thieving members
References: <C59C95A5-ABE0-4673-8F24-4D276935046C@ggttctttat.com>
Message-ID: <4962338F-CA41-46C1-B84A-3305CEFFA795@ggttctttat.com>



Dear IMSTA Board of Directors,

It is highly risible and immensely hypocritical
that as an organization supposedly dedicated to combating piracy,
you have as your member Cycling74, whose employees have
publicly acknowledged reverse engineering and pirating
3rd party software programs and sabotaging 3rd party
development efforts.

The only defense that Cycling 74's attorney could muster is
to say that Cycling74 "didn't know that reverse engineering is illegal".

As such, one of your members is culpable, not only of software piracy,
but of outright thievery and industrial espionage -- Their true slogan  
being
not 'Buy the software that you use' but rather, "Steal The software  
That You Sell"

IMSTA's complacency,  hypocrisy, negligent standards and incompetence
are a testament to its actual motives -- the persistent and systematic  
rape of
the intellectual landscape and the perverse translation of criminals  
into victims.

IMSTA = SUPPORT THOSE WHO STEAL THE SOFTWARE THAT THEY SELL [r]

		         	     THE ABS > WORST COPYRIGHT > VIOLATION


---







From worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 12 18:34:09 2009
From: worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com (jeff harrison)
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 2009 09:34:09 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Syndicate] Melusina
Message-ID: <477869.90514.qm@web52401.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Song brought Melusina to the serpent. Phantasy -- something for the alienist -- or actual, an ophidian area no larger than a raindrop charmed Melusina to further song. Seen only by Melusina, how far would the serpent have crawled?



      
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091112/fcab1ef2/attachment.htm>

From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Fri Nov 13 12:22:24 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 2009 13:22:24 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] IMSTA - Regarding one of your thieving members
Message-ID: <AAFC6EB1-9D76-45A1-8D73-3B5EA1F6D598@ggttctttat.com>



On Nov 12, 2009, at 4:41 PM, Ernst Nathorst-B??s wrote:
> Gheorge, why are you sending us the same mail as you did 18 months  
> ago?
>


Ernst,

People do what they do because they want to.
Until IMSTA addresses the underlying issues piracy will flourish.

Until IMSTA ceases to be a vehicle for the perpetuation of industrial  
espionage
and thievery and looks within its own ranks for the seeds of piracy,
nothing, abs. nothing, will be resolved.



The email:

01. Because repetition teaches people - even unscrupulous, unconscious  
programmers.

02. Because humor is inherently nonlinear. So is the PRO-logue to a  
PRO-longed public scandal.

03. By the time you understand something it is generally too late to  
do anything about it.

04. Were I you, I would be much more concerned about what IMSTA is  
SUPPORTING,
        ie., reverse engineering and industrial PIRACY.


07. The crimes of reverse engineering and industrial piracy
        perpetrated by some of your members belittle the so called  
piracy of individuals.



We are an organization whose primary scope is providing legal assistance
to individuals whose work has been pirated, misappropriated and SOLD  
for profit
by  some of your members, and companies in general.

Before IMSTA proclaims "'Buy the software that you use"
you should ensure that all IMSTA members "License the software that  
they sell",
and most certainly make NO EXCUSES about the thievery perpetrated by
some of of IMSTA's members - that is completely depraved.

Surprized you shouldn't be when some of IMSTA's members are sued for the
very thing IMSTA, unconsciously and irresponsibly, accuses individuals  
of - PIRACY.

In reality

                           IMSTA sponsors PIRACY


and is completely and utterly complacent
when its members commit PIRACY for PROFIT


In reality


                 in IMSTA one is in the company of THIEVES





---
---









From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Fri Nov 13 13:20:35 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 2009 14:20:35 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] IMSTA - Regarding one of your thieving members
In-Reply-To: <C54BB3E7-F6DC-42B4-9C50-647DB6B49BF4@imsta.org>
References: <AAFC6EB1-9D76-45A1-8D73-3B5EA1F6D598@ggttctttat.com>
	<C54BB3E7-F6DC-42B4-9C50-647DB6B49BF4@imsta.org>
Message-ID: <9E594E73-DD17-4A72-BAFB-3FBF3013D2B0@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 13, 2009, at 2:01 PM, Ernst Nathorst-B??s wrote:

> On the subject of humor: You know that one definition of insanity is  
> repeating the same action, thinking the next time it will have a  
> different effect?
>
>
> Ernst
>



Ernst,

Think of something original to say instead of repeating kitchy trivia  
statements by dead occident poptarts
to lend credence to your unconscious, irresponsible behaviour.


As I explained to you before, by the time you understand what is  
taking place it will be too late for
your unconscious self to do anything about it.

Point your attention to the THIEVES and NEMATODES in IMSTA
that routinely PIRATE others intellectual property.










> On 13 nov 2009, at 12.22, |f|||3 wrote:
>>
>>
>> Ernst,
>>
>> People do what they do because they want to.
>> Until IMSTA addresses the underlying issues piracy will flourish.
>>
>> Until IMSTA ceases to be a vehicle for the perpetuation of  
>> industrial espionage
>> and thievery and looks within its own ranks for the seeds of piracy,
>> nothing, abs. nothing, will be resolved.
>>
>>
>>
>> The email:
>>
>> 01. Because repetition teaches people - even unscrupulous,  
>> unconscious programmers.
>>
>> 02. Because humor is inherently nonlinear. So is the PRO-logue to a  
>> PRO-longed public scandal.
>>
>> 03. By the time you understand something it is generally too late  
>> to do anything about it.
>>
>> 04. Were I you, I would be much more concerned about what IMSTA is  
>> SUPPORTING,
>>     ie., reverse engineering and industrial PIRACY.
>>
>>
>> 07. The crimes of reverse engineering and industrial piracy
>>     perpetrated by some of your members belittle the so called  
>> piracy of individuals.
>>
>>
>>
>> We are an organization whose primary scope is providing legal  
>> assistance
>> to individuals whose work has been pirated, misappropriated and  
>> SOLD for profit
>> by  some of your members, and companies in general.
>>
>> Before IMSTA proclaims "'Buy the software that you use"
>> you should ensure that all IMSTA members "License the software that  
>> they sell",
>> and most certainly make NO EXCUSES about the thievery perpetrated by
>> some of of IMSTA's members - that is completely depraved.
>>
>> Surprized you shouldn't be when some of IMSTA's members are sued  
>> for the
>> very thing IMSTA, unconsciously and irresponsibly, accuses  
>> individuals of - PIRACY.
>>
>> In reality
>>
>>                        IMSTA sponsors PIRACY
>>
>>
>> and is completely and utterly complacent
>> when its members commit PIRACY for PROFIT
>>
>>
>> In reality
>>
>>
>>              in IMSTA one is in the company of THIEVES
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>> ---
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>


From matze.schmidt at n0name.de  Fri Nov 13 13:25:29 2009
From: matze.schmidt at n0name.de (Matze Schmidt)
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 2009 13:25:29 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] Kreative in die Produktion !
Message-ID: <1475810644.20091113132529@n0name.de>


          Kreative in die Produktion !

                 www.38317.tk

                ? n0name 2009

http://www.n0name.de/38317/kreativeindieproduktion


         (Sorry fuer Doppelsendungen)


          Sponsored by t-shirtz.org


From aart at eunet.rs  Sat Nov 14 12:30:51 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 12:30:51 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
Message-ID: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>




 http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/723389

Toronto Star
November 10, 2009


 Letter

West had role in Wall's erection
Re:Berlin Wall's fall inspires us still

 More important than why the Berlin Wall came down is how and why it went up 
in the first place. The West was culpable in the events that culminated in 
the erection of the Wall on Aug. 13, 1961.

 Berlin's status was unresolved after the Potsdam conference. The Soviets 
wanted it demilitarized and wanted to control access. The attempt to enforce 
their will led to the infamous blockade and the subsequent airlift of 1948. 
In 1949, the U.S. and Britain created West Germany out of the Western 
occupation zones and founded NATO, thereby cutting off and abandoning the 
East. The GDR (East Germany) came into being as a response.

>From then on, West Berlin became a massive centre of propaganda with radio 
and TV stations enticing East Germans to defect.

The Warsaw Pact was created after NATO accepted West Germany as a full 
member in 1955.

All this is not to lessen the fact that East Germany wasn't a paradise and 
the demolition of the wall was a momentous event, but to portray this as 
"our" victory is hollow.

Paul Angyal, Toronto


From info at furtherfield.org  Mon Nov 16 01:52:19 2009
From: info at furtherfield.org (info)
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 00:52:19 +0000
Subject: [Syndicate] November Issue of Furthernoise.org.
Message-ID: <4B00A243.8000003@furtherfield.org>

Sorry for any cross posting...

November Issue of Furthernoise.org.

As always we have a selection of new reviews and features for your 
reading and listening pleasure. Included in this, is a feature article 
on an innovative sound work by Aboriginal composer Rod Smith, as part of 
an exhibition produced in response to the Australian Governments Apology 
to the Indigenous population.

Our audio player is again stocked with new sounds from a diverse mix of 
international sound artists, so sit back and enjoy the new issue of 
Furthernoise.org !

Furthernoise issue November 2009
http://www.furthernoise.org/index.php?iss=83

"Highs from Low Point" (feature)
In this post-everything age, it?s hard to hear anything shatteringly new 
in the experimental ambient universe, even at the most Out-there reaches 
of the dronosphere. Yet there's still much to be savoured in the glut of 
well wrought music in this vein, among which may be numbered recent 
highs from Nottingham's Low Point.
http://www.furthernoise.org/page.php?ID=311
feature by Alan Lockett

"Yapang Marruma Soundscape - Rod Smith" (feature)
On February 12th 2008 the Australian Prime Minister Kevin Rudd made an 
apology to the 'Indigenous peoples of this land, the oldest continuing 
cultures in human history' for the 'mistreatment of those who were 
Stolen Generations [...] for the laws and policies of successive 
parliaments and governments that have inflicted profound grief, 
suffering and loss [...] 'for the indignity and degradation thus 
inflicted on a proud people and a proud culture. (excerpt).
http://www.furthernoise.org/page.php?ID=315
feature by Roger Mills

"Arturas Bum?teinas - Uniforms" (review)
Arturas Bum?teinas is a sound and visual artist based in Lithuania. 
Uniforms features experimental and post-modern pieces, blended with 
modern electronic and glitch-based techniques.
http://www.furthernoise.org/page.php?ID=313
review by Alex Young

"Echoes of Syros by Dempster, Heasley & Rieman" (review)
Stuart Dempster and Tom Heasley have successfully expanded the 
capabilities of low brass instruments, once relegated to the back of the 
band. Together with keyboard player Erik Glick Rieman, they present a 
series of improvisations that exceed the boundaries of their previous 
work and highlight potential future explorations.
http://www.furthernoise.org/page.php?ID=312
review by Caleb Deupree

"Peaceful Protest - Sade Sade" (review)
?D? Yellow Swans called it quits April 2008. In their 9 years together, 
this psych/noise duo consisting of Pete Swanson and Gabriel Mindle 
Saloman (GMS) recorded over 50 releases, toured extensively around the 
World, and co-ran the Collective JYRK label/art collective. Gabriel 
ended up moving to Vancouver, BC to start a new label called Diadem 
Discogs with his wife and music collaborator Aja Rose.
http://www.furthernoise.org/page.php?ID=314
review by Derek Morton

"The sincerest form of derivation" (review)
Remora's Derivative is a guitar ambient album with a more aggressive 
edge than other drone guitar groups like Stars of the Lid or Mirror, 
retaining enough skronk to remove any artificial polish and give the 
work the immediacy of a laid-back live performance in his living room, 
and enough melodicism to prevent the work from becoming a noise fest.
http://www.furthernoise.org/page.php?ID=309
review by Caleb Deupree



From worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 16 17:58:45 2009
From: worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com (jeff harrison)
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 08:58:45 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Syndicate] =?utf-8?q?Behind_Her_pinions=E2=80=8F?=
Message-ID: <40217.68064.qm@web52403.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Abyss is amid The Muses; Their figures Her pinions obscure. If not a surcease, Abyss is a caesura. If a caesura, things are happening behind that darkness. Behind Her pinions, a costume change? Imagine the chagrin of a Daemon costumed as a Muse. If not Daemons, then imps and such creatures accustomed to spoiling milk.

?


      
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091116/d75ced26/attachment.htm>

From difusion at medialab-prado.es  Wed Nov 18 12:56:31 2009
From: difusion at medialab-prado.es (Medialab-Prado comunicacion)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 12:56:31 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] Open Up: Call for projects on digital facades (Madrid,
	Spain)
Message-ID: <4B03E0EF.5030104@medialab-prado.es>


*Call for projects on digital facades:
Open Up**

*
Deadline: *December 10, 2009 **
*Dates of the workshop: *February 9 through 23, 2010
*Venue: *Medialab-Prado* in Madrid (Spain).

Worskhop tutors: *Jordi Claramonte, Chandler McWilliams, Casey Reas,* 
and *V?ctor Vi?a*. Directed and coordinated by *Nerea Calvillo*.* *


Open Up is a workshop for the development of projects for the digital 
fa?ade in Medialab-Prado's building. This call is addressed to the 
presentation of proposals to be collaboratively developed during the 
workshop-seminar taking place in Madrid from February 9 through 23, 2010.

The goal is to explore the relation between the urban screen and public 
space, to experiment with the screen's communicative, narrative and 
visual capacities and to investigate its potential to offer new forms of 
participation such as receiving and participating in the different 
phases of content production. Selected projects will be developed under 
the supervision of teachers, technical assistants and an extensive group 
of collaborators.

Projects presented in this call will have to explore aspects such as: 
development of strategies for public participation, activation of urban 
space through the screen, foster public visibility of agents that 
normally have none, visualization of public collectives; interaction 
with portable devices, etc.

All those interested in collaborating in one of the selected projects 
can sign in from *J**anuary 5 through February 8, 2010*.


Check the call guidelines and submit your project before *December 10, 
2009*.* *No entry fees.*
*http://medialab-prado.es/article/open_up


More information and call guidelines:
medianeralab (at) medialab-prado.es

*
Venue:*
Medialab-Prado
Plaza de las Letras
Calle Alameda, 15
28014 Madrid (Spain)


-- 
Nerea Garc?a Garmendia
Comunicaci?n / Press
Medialab-Prado
?rea de Las Artes, Ayuntamiento de Madrid
Plaza de las Letras
Alameda, 15 28014 Madrid
Tfno. +34 914 202 754
difusion at medialab-prado.es
www.medialab-prado.es



"Antes de imprimir este documento aseg?rate de que es realmente necesario. ?Gracias por tu colaboraci?n!"


-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091118/357b6d83/attachment.htm>

From worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 19 19:15:02 2009
From: worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com (jeff harrison)
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 2009 10:15:02 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Syndicate] =?utf-8?q?poets_is_chock=E2=80=8F?=
Message-ID: <449374.58972.qm@web52405.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

poets is chock
poets is exceptionally free of obscurity
poets is a derogatory comment
poets is by no means a contribution
?
poets is how well they poetry
poets is a work of a rarer species still
poets is now history
poets is a medley of folk
?
poets is as any other pursuit
poets is fully equipped with music
poets is a part of poetry
poets is mulish
?
poets is still pretty much intact
poets is to keep ajar the door
poets is welcome addition
poets is anchored by their words




      
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091119/e95e30a7/attachment.html>

From marc.garrett at furtherfield.org  Fri Nov 20 19:14:37 2009
From: marc.garrett at furtherfield.org (marc garrett)
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 2009 18:14:37 +0000
Subject: [Syndicate] Ambient.TV's Mapping CCTV around Whitehall.
Message-ID: <4B06DC8D.9020604@furtherfield.org>

Sorry for any cross posting...

Ambient.TV's Mapping CCTV around Whitehall.

Review by Rob Myers.

http://www.furtherfield.org/displayreview.php?review_id=366

Two-part exercise to map CCTV cameras around Whitehall, London, within a 
zone covered by SOCPA (Serious and Organized Crime and Police Act 2005). 
A map of the hundreds of cameras in the zone was made over two days of 
observation. The second part involved mapping the range of one of these 
cameras, no. 40 in Villiers street, by intercepting its signal as it was 
transmitted wirelessly without encryption. As passers-by entered the 
marked area covered by the camera, they were alerted to the its presence 
and handed a copy of the map of CCTV cameras in Whitehall.

"Mapping CCTV around Whitehall", 2008, is, as its name implies, a 
performance of mapping Closed Circuit Television (CCTV) security cameras 
around the UK's parliament in London and a video record of that 
performance by Ambient.tv's Manu Luksch. Starting with a HAL 9000-like 
image of a CCTV lens, the video of "Mapping CCTV In Whitehall" has a 
glitchy techno aesthetic of sound and images with a post-MTV-Style Guide 
reportage feel. The first half consists of a recording of the police 
stop-and-search interviewing Luksch under anti-terrorism legislation, 
with a map of the area superimposed. The second half consists of CCTV 
views of the range of Camera number 40 being taped out, and of the 
people caught within those bounds. Words flash on the screen to identify 
the subjects of CCTV. This redeployment of the language of mass media 
visual persuasion opens up what we see rather than closing it down, 
making it a very effective encapsulation of the project's ideas and 
aesthetics.

Mukul Patel and Manu Luksch codirect Ambient Information Systems (AIS), 
a crucible for the conception and production of collaborative, 
interdisciplinary, and critical artworks, events, and tools. They work 
as artists under their own names and also as ambientTV.NET. They have a 
history of conceiving works that integrate curatorial and collaborative 
aspects (e.g., VBI), research (FACELESS and the Data Protection Act), 
community involvement (BOW SPACE), and hybrid media installations 
(ORCHESTRA OF ANXIETY). Of particular interest are  concrete, 
contemporary issues that arise at the interface of social and technical 
infrastructures: access to information, privacy, surveillance. The 
establishment of participative processes, creation of tools, and 
archiving and documentation are signal features of recent projects.

----------------->

Other Info:

A living, breathing, thriving networked neighbourhood...

We are on Twitter
http://twitter.com/furtherfield

Other reviews/articles/interviews
http://www.furtherfield.org/reviews.php

Furtherfield - online media arts community, platforms for creating,
viewing, discussing and learning about experimental practices at the
intersections of art, technology and social change.
http://www.furtherfield.org

HTTP Gallery - physical media arts Gallery (London).
http://www.http.uk.net

Netbehaviour - an open email list community engaged in the process of
sharing and actively evolving critical approaches, methods and ideas
focused around contemporary networked media arts practice.
http://www.netbehaviour.org

Furtherfield Blog - shared space for personal reflections on media art
practice.
http://blog.furtherfield.org

VisitorsStudio - real-time, multi-user, online arena for creative 'many
to many' dialogue, networked performance and collaborative polemic.
http://www.visitorsstudio.org/x.html

Furthernoise -  an online platform for the creation, promotion,
criticism and archiving of innovative cross genre music and sound art
for the information & interaction of the public and artists alike.
http://www.furthernoise.org



From lanfranco.aceti at gmail.com  Sat Nov 21 18:03:12 2009
From: lanfranco.aceti at gmail.com (Lanfranco Aceti)
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 2009 19:03:12 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] Mish Mash: LEA Leonardo Electronic Almanac Call
Message-ID: <c799af390911210903w19ae099rd2fbc2e72e5d1c24@mail.gmail.com>

CALL FOR ARTICLES Istanbul, November-20-09

SUBJECT mish mash

In December 2009 LEA ? Leonardo Electronic Almanac, a member of the
Leonardo/ISAST/MIT Press family ? will re-launch.  Its new format will
combine the features of a high-production-value art magazine with the
scholarly rigor of an academic journal. Lanfranco Aceti, Editor in Chief,
and Paul Brown, Co-editor, intend to produce a well illustrated, attractive
and readable magazine that will simultaneously be available online as a
hyperlinked screen-resolution PDF document, a high-resolution
print-on-demand magazine and in a downloadable version for book readers on
electronic devices like the Amazon Kindle.  The publications will be
integrated into a regularly updated web portal that will provide additional
and supporting services like announcements, opportunities, interactive
content-oriented blogs and Wikis.  This LEA online environment is intended
to be a hierarchical content generator with the quarterly publication
representing a punctuated pinnacle of this multidimensional, user-driven,
discipline-oriented social network.

LEA will focus on the convergence of arts, science and technology and
combine special issue front-end features with ongoing thematic background
content.  It will combine invited and commissioned essays with peer-reviewed
scholarly papers.

The target audience for the publication encompasses a broad spectrum ranging
from professionals active in the field to laypeople with a general interest
in the contemporary arts.  We believe the time is right for an arts,
sciences and technology publication pitched centrally within the arts
mainstream.

The theme of the first issue of the Leonardo Electronic Almanac magazine is
mish mash.

The first issue will be a collection of articles, reviews and opinion pieces
that discuss and analyze the complexity of mixing things together as a
process that is not necessarily undertaken in an orderly and organized
manner. In this issue there will be contributions from Frieder Nake,
Stelarc, Paul Catanese and other important cultural operators.

Although the magazine is thematically structured, the concept of mish mash
leaves a wide open opportunity to discuss issues in interdisciplinary
education; art, science and technology interactions; personal artistic
practices; history of re-combinatory practices; hybridizations between old
and new media; cultural creolization; curatorial studies and more.
Under the editorship of Lanfranco Aceti and Paul Brown the magazine call is
open to the0retical, scientific and cultural analyses as well as practice
based pieces or a mish mash of all of the above.

The Leonardo Electronic Almanac (LEA) will produce an online and print on
demand issue, as well as host curated images and videos online.

Proposals to: info [@] leoalmanac.org

a) Subject heading: mish mash.
b) 500 hundred word abstract for articles.
c) 2 images at 72 dpi resolution no larger than 800 pixels width for
artists.
d) Links to previous work, videos or personal sites.
e) Deadline for full papers is February 15, 2010 for publication in the
first issue.
f) Please feel free to disseminate and forward this call to interested
parties.

Our publication formats allow for full-color throughout and we encourage
rich pictorial content where relevant and possible.  Note however that all
material submitted must be copyright cleared (or due diligence must be
evidenced).  For online publication a wide variety of media content may be
considered (animation, mp3, flash, java, etc?)

* For scholarly papers please submit the final paper ready for peer review.
 Your contribution will be reviewed by at least two members of the LEA board
and revisions may be requested subject to review.
* For themed and pictorial essays please submit an abstract or outline for
editorial consideration and further discussion.
* Please keep your news, announcements and hyperlinks brief and focused ?
include contact details and a link to an external site where relevant.  We
reserve the right to sub-edit your submissions in order to comply with LEA
policies and formats.  Where material is time-sensitive please include both
embargo and expiry dates.
* In all cases specify special system considerations where these are
necessary (platform, codecs, plug-ins, etc?)

We hope you share our excitement about the new LEA and we look forward to
hearing from you!

For further information or images submission contact: Ozden.Sahin [@]
leoalmanac.org

Lanfranco Aceti
Lanfranco.Aceti [@] leoalmanac.org
Editor in Chief, Leonardo Electronic Almanac

Paul Brown
Paul.Brown [@] leoalmanac.org
Co-Editor, Leonardo Electronic Almanac


http://www.lanfrancoaceti.com
Dr. Lanfranco Aceti, Associate Professor in Contemporary Art & Digital
Culture - Sabanci University
Editor in Chief, Leonardo Electronic Almanac (Leonardo Journal and MIT
Press)
Honorary Lecturer, Department of Computer Science, Virtual Reality
Environments, University College London
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091121/15e0f195/attachment-0001.htm>

From yasir.media at gmail.com  Sun Nov 22 13:38:40 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 17:38:40 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>

hey do you have anything on the left in Serbia, or the balkans as a whole?

y


On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:30 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:

>
>
>
> http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/723389
>
> Toronto Star
> November 10, 2009
>
>
> Letter
>
> West had role in Wall's erection
> Re:Berlin Wall's fall inspires us still
>
> More important than why the Berlin Wall came down is how and why it went up
> in the first place. The West was culpable in the events that culminated in
> the erection of the Wall on Aug. 13, 1961.
>
> Berlin's status was unresolved after the Potsdam conference. The Soviets
> wanted it demilitarized and wanted to control access. The attempt to enforce
> their will led to the infamous blockade and the subsequent airlift of 1948.
> In 1949, the U.S. and Britain created West Germany out of the Western
> occupation zones and founded NATO, thereby cutting off and abandoning the
> East. The GDR (East Germany) came into being as a response.
>
>  From then on, West Berlin became a massive centre of propaganda with radio
>>
>>
> and TV stations enticing East Germans to defect.
>
> The Warsaw Pact was created after NATO accepted West Germany as a full
> member in 1955.
>
> All this is not to lessen the fact that East Germany wasn't a paradise and
> the demolition of the wall was a momentous event, but to portray this as
> "our" victory is hollow.
>
> Paul Angyal, Toronto
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091122/caba4feb/attachment.htm>

From aart at eunet.rs  Sun Nov 22 14:06:50 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 14:06:50 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>

How do you mean "left"?
Andrej


> hey do you have anything on the left in Serbia, or the balkans as a whole?
>
> y
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:30 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/723389
>>
>> Toronto Star
>> November 10, 2009
>>
>>
>> Letter
>>
>> West had role in Wall's erection
>> Re:Berlin Wall's fall inspires us still
>>
>> More important than why the Berlin Wall came down is how and why it went 
>> up
>> in the first place. The West was culpable in the events that culminated 
>> in
>> the erection of the Wall on Aug. 13, 1961.
>>
>> Berlin's status was unresolved after the Potsdam conference. The Soviets
>> wanted it demilitarized and wanted to control access. The attempt to 
>> enforce
>> their will led to the infamous blockade and the subsequent airlift of 
>> 1948.
>> In 1949, the U.S. and Britain created West Germany out of the Western
>> occupation zones and founded NATO, thereby cutting off and abandoning the
>> East. The GDR (East Germany) came into being as a response.
>>
>>  From then on, West Berlin became a massive centre of propaganda with 
>> radio
>>>
>>>
>> and TV stations enticing East Germans to defect.
>>
>> The Warsaw Pact was created after NATO accepted West Germany as a full
>> member in 1955.
>>
>> All this is not to lessen the fact that East Germany wasn't a paradise 
>> and
>> the demolition of the wall was a momentous event, but to portray this as
>> "our" victory is hollow.
>>
>> Paul Angyal, Toronto
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>
>


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
> 


From yasir.media at gmail.com  Sun Nov 22 14:47:33 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 18:47:33 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com> 
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>

Left-wing, socialists, anti-imperialists, may be even communists,
 as opposed to right-wing, conservative, religious maybe

On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 6:06 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:

> How do you mean "left"?
> Andrej
>
>
>
>  hey do you have anything on the left in Serbia, or the balkans as a whole?
>>
>> y
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:30 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/723389
>>>
>>> Toronto Star
>>> November 10, 2009
>>>
>>>
>>> Letter
>>>
>>> West had role in Wall's erection
>>> Re:Berlin Wall's fall inspires us still
>>>
>>> More important than why the Berlin Wall came down is how and why it went
>>> up
>>> in the first place. The West was culpable in the events that culminated
>>> in
>>> the erection of the Wall on Aug. 13, 1961.
>>>
>>> Berlin's status was unresolved after the Potsdam conference. The Soviets
>>> wanted it demilitarized and wanted to control access. The attempt to
>>> enforce
>>> their will led to the infamous blockade and the subsequent airlift of
>>> 1948.
>>> In 1949, the U.S. and Britain created West Germany out of the Western
>>> occupation zones and founded NATO, thereby cutting off and abandoning the
>>> East. The GDR (East Germany) came into being as a response.
>>>
>>>  From then on, West Berlin became a massive centre of propaganda with
>>> radio
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  and TV stations enticing East Germans to defect.
>>>
>>> The Warsaw Pact was created after NATO accepted West Germany as a full
>>> member in 1955.
>>>
>>> All this is not to lessen the fact that East Germany wasn't a paradise
>>> and
>>> the demolition of the wall was a momentous event, but to portray this as
>>> "our" victory is hollow.
>>>
>>> Paul Angyal, Toronto
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Syndicate mailing list
>>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091122/6ecedc4b/attachment.htm>

From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Sun Nov 22 15:34:15 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 16:34:15 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 22, 2009, at 3:47 PM, yasir ~?? ?? wrote:

> Left-wing, socialists, anti-imperialists, may be even communists,


Those are all conservatives.






>  as opposed to right-wing, conservative, religious maybe
>
> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 6:06 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
> How do you mean "left"?
> Andrej
>
>
>
> hey do you have anything on the left in Serbia, or the balkans as a  
> whole?
>
> y
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:30 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/723389
>
> Toronto Star
> November 10, 2009
>
>
> Letter
>
> West had role in Wall's erection
> Re:Berlin Wall's fall inspires us still
>
> More important than why the Berlin Wall came down is how and why it  
> went up
> in the first place. The West was culpable in the events that  
> culminated in
> the erection of the Wall on Aug. 13, 1961.
>
> Berlin's status was unresolved after the Potsdam conference. The  
> Soviets
> wanted it demilitarized and wanted to control access. The attempt to  
> enforce
> their will led to the infamous blockade and the subsequent airlift  
> of 1948.
> In 1949, the U.S. and Britain created West Germany out of the Western
> occupation zones and founded NATO, thereby cutting off and  
> abandoning the
> East. The GDR (East Germany) came into being as a response.
>
>  From then on, West Berlin became a massive centre of propaganda  
> with radio
>
>
> and TV stations enticing East Germans to defect.
>
> The Warsaw Pact was created after NATO accepted West Germany as a full
> member in 1955.
>
> All this is not to lessen the fact that East Germany wasn't a  
> paradise and
> the demolition of the wall was a momentous event, but to portray  
> this as
> "our" victory is hollow.
>
> Paul Angyal, Toronto
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091122/3eb03b29/attachment-0001.htm>

From yasir.media at gmail.com  Sun Nov 22 17:02:26 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 21:02:26 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com> 
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com> 
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>

radicals, syndicalists, anarchists, anarcho-syndicalists,  and more rec
ently ... anti-globalists, libertarians,    .... while otoh there have been
malangs, faqirs, qalandars, ....  :D



On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:34 PM, | f | | | 3 <n2o at ggttctttat.com> wrote:

>
> On Nov 22, 2009, at 3:47 PM, yasir ~?? ?? wrote:
>
> Left-wing, socialists, anti-imperialists, may be even communists,
>
>
>
> Those are all conservatives.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  as opposed to right-wing, conservative, religious maybe
>
> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 6:06 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
>
>> How do you mean "left"?
>> Andrej
>>
>>
>>
>>  hey do you have anything on the left in Serbia, or the balkans as a
>>> whole?
>>>
>>> y
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:30 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/723389
>>>>
>>>> Toronto Star
>>>> November 10, 2009
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Letter
>>>>
>>>> West had role in Wall's erection
>>>> Re:Berlin Wall's fall inspires us still
>>>>
>>>> More important than why the Berlin Wall came down is how and why it went
>>>> up
>>>> in the first place. The West was culpable in the events that culminated
>>>> in
>>>> the erection of the Wall on Aug. 13, 1961.
>>>>
>>>> Berlin's status was unresolved after the Potsdam conference. The Soviets
>>>> wanted it demilitarized and wanted to control access. The attempt to
>>>> enforce
>>>> their will led to the infamous blockade and the subsequent airlift of
>>>> 1948.
>>>> In 1949, the U.S. and Britain created West Germany out of the Western
>>>> occupation zones and founded NATO, thereby cutting off and abandoning
>>>> the
>>>> East. The GDR (East Germany) came into being as a response.
>>>>
>>>>  From then on, West Berlin became a massive centre of propaganda with
>>>> radio
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>  and TV stations enticing East Germans to defect.
>>>>
>>>> The Warsaw Pact was created after NATO accepted West Germany as a full
>>>> member in 1955.
>>>>
>>>> All this is not to lessen the fact that East Germany wasn't a paradise
>>>> and
>>>> the demolition of the wall was a momentous event, but to portray this as
>>>> "our" victory is hollow.
>>>>
>>>> Paul Angyal, Toronto
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Syndicate mailing list
>>>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>>>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>> Syndicate mailing list
>>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091122/802c8e93/attachment.htm>

From aart at eunet.rs  Sun Nov 22 19:53:53 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 19:53:53 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>

Yes we have in Serbia socialists, communists, but they are now in ruling 
coalition with mondialist, gobalist and liberal capitalist democrats. That 
is a paradox.
But we have strong anti-imperialist, anti-globalist radical national 
parties, which are by definition right wing, which are in opposition. You 
know, we lived for 60 years under communists, so in our country all 
progressive parties are anti-communists, nationalists with strong religious 
background. Ruling party is globalist, American puppets in coalition with 
communists.
Andrej




> Left-wing, socialists, anti-imperialists, may be even communists,
> as opposed to right-wing, conservative, religious maybe
radicals, syndicalists, anarchists, anarcho-syndicalists,  and more rec
ently ... anti-globalists, libertarians,    .... while otoh there have been
malangs, faqirs, qalandars, ....  :D

>>  hey do you have anything on the left in Serbia, or the balkans as a
>>> whole?




From yasir.media at gmail.com  Sun Nov 22 20:37:38 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 00:37:38 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com> 
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com> 
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>

so in our country all progressive parties are anti-communists, nationalists
with strong religious background

by progressive i take it you mean forward-looking, in fact you mean orthodox
religious nationalists, but not left, (which sounds like another
contradiction).

the anti-imperialist vs. capitalist is a pretty universal equation these
days everywhere...
we are trying to get rid of the religious types (they are in retreat :). the
nationalism is strong too.

y



On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 11:53 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:

> so in our country all progressive parties are anti-communists, nationalists
> with strong religious background
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/62448322/attachment.htm>

From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Sun Nov 22 21:14:40 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 20:14:40 +0000
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>

Hey guys, sorry for sneeking into your conversation, but this dialog on the
balkans is quite annoying.... it's just a hype.

"Uau the balkans!!!! Everybody is crazy about the balkans" - boring
bulls**t. The balkans are like everywhere else, except that until now they
have less money than everyone else, but it all resumes to buying and power
of consuming. It was once a dreamy fairytale, but now there's no difference
to the rest - left or right. In this world all this dichotomy is nothing but
rhetoric - everybody talks about it because  it is a plus point, but a
'thousand kisses deep' it's as empty as unfertile.

There is so much more to explore and since years nobody is able to leave
this "balkan-ology", when you have a much more "rich" europe where you
didn't bother yet to look. It was 20 years ago.... it is gone.

Good night
and sorry again for my uninhibited thought, apologies to all the
*gipsies*that sing for me on the streets...




On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM, yasir ~?? ?? <yasir.media at gmail.com> wrote:

> so in our country all progressive parties are anti-communists, nationalists
> with strong religious background
>
> by progressive i take it you mean forward-looking, in fact you mean
> orthodox religious nationalists, but not left, (which sounds like another
> contradiction).
>
> the anti-imperialist vs. capitalist is a pretty universal equation these
> days everywhere...
> we are trying to get rid of the religious types (they are in retreat :).
> the nationalism is strong too.
>
> y
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 11:53 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
>
>> so in our country all progressive parties are anti-communists,
>> nationalists with strong religious background
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091122/1228fca3/attachment.htm>

From propaganda at goto10.org  Sun Nov 22 21:24:21 2009
From: propaganda at goto10.org (propaganda at goto10.org)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 21:24:21 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] MAKE ART 09 - 08>13 December 2009 - Poitiers
Message-ID: <20091122202421.GR31439@goto10.org>

#!/bin/bash
cat <<":*" |
                                               _
   _        _     ____     _       _   _______|_|         
  | |_    _| |  _|____|_  | |    _|_| |  _____|           
  |  _|__|_  | | |____| | | |___|_|   | |_____            
  | | |__| | | |  ____  | |  ___|_    |  _____|           
  | |      | | | |_   | | | |   |_|_  | |_______          
  |_|_     |_| |___|  |_| |_|     |_| |_________|         
    |_|_          ____     _______     _________          
      |_|       _|____|_  |  _____|_  |___   ___|_    _   
               | |____| | | |_____|_|     | |   |_|  |_|  
  08-13 DEC    |  __    | |  _   _|       | |             
  2009         | |  |_  | | | |_|___     _|_|             
  POITIERS     |_|    |_| |_|   |___|   |_|               
 

make art is an international festival dedicated to the integration of
Free/Libre/Open Source Software (FLOSS) in digital art.

The fourth edition of make art - What The Fork?! distributed and open
practices in FLOSS art - will take place in Poitiers (FR), from the 8th
to the 13th of December 2009.

With Aharon Amir (GB), Wayne Clements (GB), FooCorp (GB), Gijs Gieskes
(NL), Gullibloon (AT/DE), Adnan Hadzi (CH), Lisa Haskel (GB), Reni
Hofm?ller (AT), Olivier Laruelle (FR), LAFKON (DE), Anne Lafor?t (FR),
Mattin (ES), Antoine Moreau (FR), Nathalie Magnan (FR), No Copy Paste
(HU), Noyade (FR), Jean S?pulchre (FR), Wesley Smith (US), Koray
Tahiro#lu (TR/FI), The Guardians of the Tradition (US), Taku Unami (JP),
Milovann Yanatchkov (FR), Simon Yuill (GB), J?r?mie Zimmermann (FR),
IOhannes M. Zm?lnig (AT), ...

http://makeart.goto10.org

--

make art est un festival international d?di? ? l'int?gration des
Logiciels Libres et Open Source (FLOSS*) dans l'art num?rique.  
*FLOSS = Free/Libre/Open Source Software

La quatri?me ?dition de make art - "What The Fork?!" pratiques
distribu?es et ouvertes en art logiciel libre - se d?roule ? Poitiers
(FR), du 8 au 13 d?cembre 2009.

Avec Aharon Amir (GB), Wayne Clements (GB), FooCorp (GB), Gijs Gieskes
(NL), Gullibloon (AT/DE), Adnan Hadzi (CH), Lisa Haskel (GB), Reni
Hofm?ller (AT), Olivier Laruelle (FR), LAFKON (DE), Anne Lafor?t (FR),
Mattin (ES), Antoine Moreau (FR), Nathalie Magnan (FR), No Copy Paste
(HU), Noyade (FR), Jean S?pulchre (FR), Wesley Smith (US), Koray
Tahiro#lu (TR/FI), The Guardians of the Tradition (US), Taku Unami (JP),
Milovann Yanatchkov (FR), Simon Yuill (GB), J?r?mie Zimmermann (FR),
IOhannes M. Zm?lnig (AT), ...

http://makeart.goto10.org

:*

(
( echo '[-]>[-]---------->[-],[----------[>[-]++++++++++,----------]'
  echo '<[++++++++++.<]>++++++++++.-------------------->[-],]' ) | (
echo '#include <stdio.h>'
echo '#include <stdlib.h>'
echo 'int main(int c, char **a){'
echo 'char *makeart = calloc(2009,1);'
sed -e 's/+/++*makeart;\n/g' \
    -e 's/-/--*makeart;\n/g' \
    -e 's/>/++makeart;\n/g' \
    -e 's/</--makeart;\n/g' \
    -e 's/\./putchar\(*makeart\);\n/g' \
    -e 's/,/{int i = getchar\(\);if\(i!=EOF\)*makeart=i;}\n/g' \
    -e 's/\[/while\(*makeart\){\n/g' \
    -e 's/\]/}\n/g' \
    -e 't' \
    -e 's/.//g'
echo 'return 0;}'
) | gcc -O2 -Wall -std=c99 -pedantic -o makeart -xc - &&
./makeart | ./makeart
)


From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Sun Nov 22 23:02:45 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 00:02:45 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 22, 2009, at 10:14 PM, Susane McKinney wrote:
>

> Hey guys, sorry for sneeking into your conversation, but this dialog  
> on the balkans is quite annoying.... it's just a hype.
>
> "Uau the balkans!!!! Everybody is crazy about the balkans" - boring  
> bulls**t. The balkans are like everywhere else, except that until  
> now they have less money than everyone else, but it all resumes to  
> buying and power of consuming. It was once a dreamy fairytale, but  
> now there's no difference to the rest - left or right. In this world  
> all this dichotomy is nothing but rhetoric - everybody talks about  
> it because  it is a plus point, but a 'thousand kisses deep' it's as  
> empty as unfertile.
>
> There is so much more to explore and since years nobody is able to  
> leave this "balkan-ology", when you have a much more "rich" europe  
> where you didn't bother yet to look. It was 20 years ago.... it is  
> gone.
>
> Good night
> and sorry again for my uninhibited thought, apologies to all the  
> gipsies that sing for me on the streets...
>


The balkans ur imaging may be the bs  mentioned by inke arns et al.

western europe has been conquered.

the balkans is being conquered.


Re: money - u knou NOT what u speak ov


There is less 'money' in the so called developing areas of the planet
because property classification is largely ad hoc / non standardized
and therefore cannot be easily leveraged/prostituted on a large scale.

Think of it this way - habar n-ai ce vorbesc acum but now you can  
understand because English is FREE.


In the '1st world' everything has been catalogued and classified,  
measured, taxed and its value stamped accordingly.
This allows a property's owner to mortgage said property easily.

Thus the superior money flow in the west.
And as illustrated very recently it's largely funny / fiat money.

This is the reason communism failed - its twin, capitalism, has become  
so fluid that
communism simply couldnt compete any longer.


In the '3rd world'  (which truthfully should include western europe
as compared to the USA it is simply backwards+++++++++)   ---   in the  
'3rd world'
personal property is largely uncatalogued and further, the mountains  
upon mountains of bureaucracy
prohibit one from easily leveraging/prostituting this wealth outside  
the small scale.


In the 1st world wealth = debt

Last occident fairy tale = credit


The large scale sucks in the balkans, but it does so less than in  
western europe
-- the USA is light years ahead.


So - if you are bored bring ur occident komponents 2 the balkans
and we'll leverage them for you, FREELY >








>
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM, yasir ~?? ??  
> <yasir.media at gmail.com> wrote:
> so in our country all progressive parties are anti-communists,  
> nationalists with strong religious background
>
> by progressive i take it you mean forward-looking, in fact you mean  
> orthodox religious nationalists, but not left, (which sounds like  
> another contradiction).
>
> the anti-imperialist vs. capitalist is a pretty universal equation  
> these days everywhere...
> we are trying to get rid of the religious types (they are in  
> retreat :). the nationalism is strong too.
>
> y
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 11:53 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
> so in our country all progressive parties are anti-communists,  
> nationalists with strong religious background
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/6a29f23a/attachment.htm>

From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Mon Nov 23 00:18:34 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 23:18:34 +0000
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>

The balkans ur imaging may be the bs  mentioned by inke arns et al.
>

Who is that?



> western europe has been conquered.
>
> the balkans is being conquered.
>

The world was already conquered... again - has nothing to do with balkans or
west.


>
> Re: money - u knou NOT what u speak ov
>
>
oh YES I do. Believe me.


In the 1st world wealth = debt
>
> Last occident fairy tale = credit
>
>
Interesting point of view, but I'm interested in other issues, like people,
literally, and not where they come from, just how they are.


> The large scale sucks in the balkans, but it does so less than in western
> europe
> -- the USA is light years ahead.
>

No doubt of that. You live in the US?


>
>

> So - if you are bored bring ur occident komponents 2 the balkans
> and we'll leverage them for you, FREELY >
>
>
"We", means that you are a balkaner? I appreciate your offer, but I think
I'm comfortable where I am. One has to keep his roots... even if the
physical place is another, there are things that will never change.

But I still don't think the balkans are what the cool people want to make of
it... I've been already in many 'balkans' and not all were named that way.
And my problem is exactly that - everything is labeled, not all is really
discovered and experienced.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091122/01bdd98e/attachment.htm>

From yasir.media at gmail.com  Mon Nov 23 10:32:10 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 14:32:10 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com> 
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com> 
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com> 
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com> 
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911230132m69d81c0ayb757c00ca7e8676e@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks for jumping on the label : balkans
with the assumption i am not talking about:  people

I assume you are now awake: so what is cool about balkans, please tell,
its not just the gypsies, is it ?  or the strong hate that Balkan "people"
regard them in ?

i want to know how deep is 2000 kisses.

best





On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 4:18 AM, Susane McKinney <mcksuzz at googlemail.com>wrote:

>
>
>
> The balkans ur imaging may be the bs  mentioned by inke arns et al.
>>
>
> Who is that?
>
>
>
>> western europe has been conquered.
>>
>> the balkans is being conquered.
>>
>
> The world was already conquered... again - has nothing to do with balkans
> or west.
>
>
>>
>> Re: money - u knou NOT what u speak ov
>>
>>
> oh YES I do. Believe me.
>
>
> In the 1st world wealth = debt
>>
>> Last occident fairy tale = credit
>>
>>
> Interesting point of view, but I'm interested in other issues, like people,
> literally, and not where they come from, just how they are.
>
>
>> The large scale sucks in the balkans, but it does so less than in western
>> europe
>> -- the USA is light years ahead.
>>
>
> No doubt of that. You live in the US?
>
>
>>
>>
>
>> So - if you are bored bring ur occident komponents 2 the balkans
>> and we'll leverage them for you, FREELY >
>>
>>
> "We", means that you are a balkaner? I appreciate your offer, but I think
> I'm comfortable where I am. One has to keep his roots... even if the
> physical place is another, there are things that will never change.
>
> But I still don't think the balkans are what the cool people want to make
> of it... I've been already in many 'balkans' and not all were named that
> way. And my problem is exactly that - everything is labeled, not all is
> really discovered and experienced.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/78c6bcdf/attachment.htm>

From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Mon Nov 23 11:21:00 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 11:21:00 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <5af37bb0911230132m69d81c0ayb757c00ca7e8676e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
	<5af37bb0911230132m69d81c0ayb757c00ca7e8676e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911230221m526ca990j7c18c18b3f43a7f8@mail.gmail.com>

Well, I meant: Politics are the same everywhere, what's left is only
consume.

Balkans, how the new 'illuminati' see it today is for me a hoax. Like the
Balkans there are lots of places. What interests me are the people and their
differences not because they were born in the Balkans or in Texas.

A thousand kisses deep was a methaphor for when one explores a subject a bit
deeper.

Saludos.
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 10:32 AM, yasir ~?? ?? <yasir.media at gmail.com>wrote:

> Thanks for jumping on the label : balkans
> with the assumption i am not talking about:  people
>
> I assume you are now awake: so what is cool about balkans, please tell,
> its not just the gypsies, is it ?  or the strong hate that Balkan "people"
> regard them in ?
>
> i want to know how deep is 2000 kisses.
>
> best
>
>
>
>
>
>   On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 4:18 AM, Susane McKinney <mcksuzz at googlemail.com
> > wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>>   The balkans ur imaging may be the bs  mentioned by inke arns et al.
>>>
>>
>> Who is that?
>>
>>
>>
>>>  western europe has been conquered.
>>>
>>> the balkans is being conquered.
>>>
>>
>> The world was already conquered... again - has nothing to do with balkans
>> or west.
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Re: money - u knou NOT what u speak ov
>>>
>>>
>> oh YES I do. Believe me.
>>
>>
>>   In the 1st world wealth = debt
>>>
>>> Last occident fairy tale = credit
>>>
>>>
>> Interesting point of view, but I'm interested in other issues, like
>> people, literally, and not where they come from, just how they are.
>>
>>
>>>   The large scale sucks in the balkans, but it does so less than in
>>> western europe
>>> -- the USA is light years ahead.
>>>
>>
>> No doubt of that. You live in the US?
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>> So - if you are bored bring ur occident komponents 2 the balkans
>>> and we'll leverage them for you, FREELY >
>>>
>>>
>> "We", means that you are a balkaner? I appreciate your offer, but I think
>> I'm comfortable where I am. One has to keep his roots... even if the
>> physical place is another, there are things that will never change.
>>
>> But I still don't think the balkans are what the cool people want to make
>> of it... I've been already in many 'balkans' and not all were named that
>> way. And my problem is exactly that - everything is labeled, not all is
>> really discovered and experienced.
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/adfc97e2/attachment-0001.htm>

From yasir.media at gmail.com  Mon Nov 23 12:12:39 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 16:12:39 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911230221m526ca990j7c18c18b3f43a7f8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc> 
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com> 
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com> 
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com> 
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com> 
	<5af37bb0911230132m69d81c0ayb757c00ca7e8676e@mail.gmail.com> 
	<aea82d2c0911230221m526ca990j7c18c18b3f43a7f8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911230312t10675e19tc71988f5354cc7aa@mail.gmail.com>

this time you have underestimated what i wrote:

i am talking about the real place and real people, serbia, romania, , there
has been ethnic/nationalists fighting and tensions. The differences between
people can be made to become very big.... and there is the orthodox church
which is also very real, there's probably a revival of religion ...


Andrej .....




On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 3:21 PM, Susane McKinney <mcksuzz at googlemail.com>wrote:

> Well, I meant: Politics are the same everywhere, what's left is only
> consume.
>
> Balkans, how the new 'illuminati' see it today is for me a hoax. Like the
> Balkans there are lots of places. What interests me are the people and their
> differences not because they were born in the Balkans or in Texas.
>
> A thousand kisses deep was a methaphor for when one explores a subject a
> bit deeper.
>
> Saludos.
> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 10:32 AM, yasir ~?? ?? <yasir.media at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Thanks for jumping on the label : balkans
>> with the assumption i am not talking about:  people
>>
>> I assume you are now awake: so what is cool about balkans, please tell,
>> its not just the gypsies, is it ?  or the strong hate that Balkan
>> "people"  regard them in ?
>>
>> i want to know how deep is 2000 kisses.
>>
>> best
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>   On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 4:18 AM, Susane McKinney <
>> mcksuzz at googlemail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>   The balkans ur imaging may be the bs  mentioned by inke arns et al.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Who is that?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>  western europe has been conquered.
>>>>
>>>> the balkans is being conquered.
>>>>
>>>
>>> The world was already conquered... again - has nothing to do with balkans
>>> or west.
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Re: money - u knou NOT what u speak ov
>>>>
>>>>
>>> oh YES I do. Believe me.
>>>
>>>
>>>   In the 1st world wealth = debt
>>>>
>>>> Last occident fairy tale = credit
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Interesting point of view, but I'm interested in other issues, like
>>> people, literally, and not where they come from, just how they are.
>>>
>>>
>>>>   The large scale sucks in the balkans, but it does so less than in
>>>> western europe
>>>> -- the USA is light years ahead.
>>>>
>>>
>>> No doubt of that. You live in the US?
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>> So - if you are bored bring ur occident komponents 2 the balkans
>>>> and we'll leverage them for you, FREELY >
>>>>
>>>>
>>> "We", means that you are a balkaner? I appreciate your offer, but I think
>>> I'm comfortable where I am. One has to keep his roots... even if the
>>> physical place is another, there are things that will never change.
>>>
>>> But I still don't think the balkans are what the cool people want to make
>>> of it... I've been already in many 'balkans' and not all were named that
>>> way. And my problem is exactly that - everything is labeled, not all is
>>> really discovered and experienced.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Syndicate mailing list
>>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/d87a30e5/attachment.htm>

From aart at eunet.rs  Mon Nov 23 12:32:34 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 12:32:34 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc><5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>

From: "yasir ~?? ??" <yasir.media at gmail.com>
To: "SYNDICATE ||" <syndicate at ck13.org>
Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2009 5:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall


>by progressive i take it you mean forward-looking, in fact you mean 
>orthodox
>religious nationalists, but not left, (which sounds like another
>contradiction).

In my opinion forwardlooking people should be religious or the world will 
dissapear. Religion is not an ideology but way of life, way of breathing. It 
should be learned, and it needs personal sacrefice, it is not just like 
believe in one party or one ecomic system and wote for them. It comes from 
inside, from purification of soul.

>we are trying to get rid of the religious types (they are in retreat :). 
>the
>nationalism is strong too.

Where are you living Yasir?
Andrej 


From aart at eunet.rs  Mon Nov 23 12:45:59 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 12:45:59 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc><5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
	<5af37bb0911230132m69d81c0ayb757c00ca7e8676e@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911230221m526ca990j7c18c18b3f43a7f8@mail.gmail.com>
	<5af37bb0911230312t10675e19tc71988f5354cc7aa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <76E77D0304ED4957838DBD40A2DD43B5@desktoppc>


Andrej Tisma -  artist, art critic and  curator
WEBSITE: http://www.atisma.com/

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "yasir ~?? ??" <yasir.media at gmail.com>
To: "SYNDICATE ||" <syndicate at ck13.org>
Sent: Monday, November 23, 2009 12:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall


>i am talking about the real place and real people, serbia, romania, , there
>has been ethnic/nationalists fighting and tensions. The differences between
>people can be made to become very big.... and there is the orthodox church
>which is also very real, there's probably a revival of religion ...

Yes there are big differences between people in Balkans, similar as 
everywhere else I think, but the conflicts and violence were fabricated from 
outside, supported from USA, EU I asure you. I lived my first 40 years in 
the former Yugoslavia and it was nice, no tensions, I even was not aware of 
my own nationality. But when tima came to split Yugoslavia the CIA and MI5 
did their job well. After them came NATO bombers and yes, we we poorer, but 
people are still very nice, emotional, vivid.
Andrej


From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Mon Nov 23 13:52:20 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 14:52:20 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 23, 2009, at 1:18 AM, Susane McKinney wrote:

>
> western europe has been conquered.
>
> the balkans is being conquered.
>
> The world was already conquered... again - has nothing to do with  
> balkans or west.


Some of the world has been conquered.
Has everything to do with the balkans + 'third world
since some includes all ... of the west.



>
>
> Re: money - u knou NOT what u speak ov
>
>
> oh YES I do. Believe me.


Reason you say that there is less money in the balkans +?

You know not what you speak of - very seriously.



>
>
> Interesting point of view, but I'm interested in other issues, like  
> people, literally, and not where they come from, just how they are.
>


One can't reverse engineer childhood.



> The large scale sucks in the balkans, but it does so less than in  
> western europe
> -- the USA is light years ahead.
>
> No doubt of that. You live in the US?


Sometimes I do. The large scale is superior to anywhere else =  
corporate communism




>
> So - if you are bored bring ur occident komponents 2 the balkans
> and we'll leverage them for you, FREELY >
>
>
> "We", means that you are a balkaner?


One can't reverse engineer childhood.



> I appreciate your offer, but I think I'm comfortable where I am.


Offer stands - FREE LEVERAGING



> One has to keep his roots... even if the physical place is another,  
> there are things that will never change.
>
> But I still don't think the balkans are what the cool people want to  
> make of it...


I'm talking about the balkans before the cool people started talking  
about the balkans.
The balkans that has always been there - nameless.



> I've been already in many 'balkans' and not all were named that way.  
> And my problem is exactly that - everything is labeled, not all is  
> really discovered and experienced.
>


Are the dead things you eat unlabeled / do you grow/kill what you  
konsume or do others feed you +?


http://www.0f0003.com/data/pikz/isea09/nn%20isea09.txt







































From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Mon Nov 23 13:54:34 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 14:54:34 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc><5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 23, 2009, at 1:32 PM, Andrej Tisma wrote:
>
>> by progressive i take it you mean forward-looking, in fact you mean  
>> orthodox
>> religious nationalists, but not left, (which sounds like another
>> contradiction).
>
> In my opinion forwardlooking people should be religious or the world  
> will dissapear.


Agreed






> Religion is not an ideology but way of life, way of breathing. It  
> should be learned, and it needs personal sacrefice, it is not just  
> like believe in one party or one ecomic system and wote for them. It  
> comes from inside, from purification of soul.
>
>> we are trying to get rid of the religious types (they are in  
>> retreat :). the
>> nationalism is strong too.
>
> Where are you living Yasir?
> Andrej ]


From yasir.media at gmail.com  Mon Nov 23 16:10:04 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 20:10:04 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com> 
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com> 
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com> 
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
	<B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911230710o5563168bh67e058282219824a@mail.gmail.com>

i agree with that. as long as it doesn't translate into closed-mindedness...

but your government hasn't taken a religous mantle yet. its probably
secular.
Things will change when people want to undo that. the first thing to misuse
and distort is religion for political purposes...

its also interesting to compare the revival of ethnicity, religion, ... with
the ex-soviet states uzbekistan, tajikistan...

i am in karachi. i was in romania and hungary in feb.  uzbekistan in oct.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_7ZgeBVo7w

best



On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 5:54 PM, | f | | | 3 <n2o at ggttctttat.com> wrote:

>
> On Nov 23, 2009, at 1:32 PM, Andrej Tisma wrote:
>
>>
>>  by progressive i take it you mean forward-looking, in fact you mean
>>> orthodox
>>> religious nationalists, but not left, (which sounds like another
>>> contradiction).
>>>
>>
>> In my opinion forwardlooking people should be religious or the world will
>> dissapear.
>>
>
>
> Agreed
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  Religion is not an ideology but way of life, way of breathing. It should
>> be learned, and it needs personal sacrefice, it is not just like believe in
>> one party or one ecomic system and wote for them. It comes from inside, from
>> purification of soul.
>>
>>  we are trying to get rid of the religious types (they are in retreat :).
>>> the
>>> nationalism is strong too.
>>>
>>
>> Where are you living Yasir?
>> Andrej ]
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/ae13f943/attachment-0001.htm>

From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Mon Nov 23 16:11:28 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 16:11:28 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
	<B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911230711n3da2308di9b4ece9479934b65@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:54 PM, | f | | | 3 <n2o at ggttctttat.com> wrote:

>
> On Nov 23, 2009, at 1:32 PM, Andrej Tisma wrote:
>
>>
>> by progressive i take it you mean forward-looking, in fact you mean
>>> orthodox
>>> religious nationalists, but not left, (which sounds like another
>>> contradiction).
>>>
>>
>> In my opinion forwardlooking people should be religious or the world will
>> dissapear.
>>
>
>
> Agreed
>
>
>

People should be spiritual and not only 'be' but specially take it seriously
and honestly - that's a difficulty even for the most real and genuin
"balkanese".
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/a12370ee/attachment.htm>

From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Mon Nov 23 16:27:51 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 16:27:51 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
	<10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com>

>
>> western europe has been conquered.
>>
>> the balkans is being conquered.
>>
>> The world was already conquered... again - has nothing to do with balkans
>> or west.
>>
>
>
> Some of the world has been conquered.
> Has everything to do with the balkans + 'third world
> since some includes all ... of the west.


Again (because I am stubborn) - the whole world was already conquered and I
believe still it has very less to do with the Balkans.



>
>
>
>
>
>>
>> Re: money - u knou NOT what u speak ov
>>
>>
>> oh YES I do. Believe me.
>>
>
>
> Reason you say that there is less money in the balkans +?
>
> You know not what you speak of - very seriously.
>
What makes you be sure that you do know what you speak of? Who/what can give
you such assuredness? Besides the Balkans (not including rich european
countries) have you ever been to other countries in Europe? Have you been
there on holiday or have you experienced real life on those countries?




>
>
>
>>
>> Interesting point of view, but I'm interested in other issues, like
>> people, literally, and not where they come from, just how they are.
>>
>>
>
> One can't reverse engineer childhood.
>
That's the most truthful thought you had so far, even so, too modern for me.



>
>
>  The large scale sucks in the balkans, but it does so less than in western
>> europe
>> -- the USA is light years ahead.
>>
>> No doubt of that. You live in the US?
>>
>
>
> Sometimes I do. The large scale is superior to anywhere else = corporate
> communism


I already agreed on this.




>
>> So - if you are bored bring ur occident komponents 2 the balkans
>> and we'll leverage them for you, FREELY >
>>
>>
>> "We", means that you are a balkaner?
>>
>
>
> One can't reverse engineer childhood.
>
So you come from the Balkans... where, if I may ask?



>
>
>  I appreciate your offer, but I think I'm comfortable where I am.
>>
>
>
> Offer stands - FREE LEVERAGING
>
Are you trying to seduce me? If so, for what exactly?




>
>  One has to keep his roots... even if the physical place is another, there
>> are things that will never change.
>>
>> But I still don't think the balkans are what the cool people want to make
>> of it...
>>
>
>
> I'm talking about the balkans before the cool people started talking about
> the balkans.
>
Aren't you one of those cool people?



> The balkans that has always been there - nameless.


The Balkans as many other countries from which nobody talks about, which are
still equally nameless and traditional and incredibly rich in culture.



>  I've been already in many 'balkans' and not all were named that way. And
>> my problem is exactly that - everything is labeled, not all is really
>> discovered and experienced.
>>
>>
>
> Are the dead things you eat unlabeled / do you grow/kill what you konsume
> or do others feed you +?
>
When I'm lucky, they are unlabeled, when I'm lucky I do grow and kill what i
consume, when I'm lucky I have a very traditional family that does it for me
- without labels, unfortunatly that doesn't happen the whole time.




> http://www.0f0003.com/data/pikz/isea09/nn%20isea09.txt


I need more time for that. Maybe later.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/da587c7b/attachment.htm>

From yasir.media at gmail.com  Mon Nov 23 16:48:32 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 20:48:32 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911230711n3da2308di9b4ece9479934b65@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com> 
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com> 
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com> 
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
	<B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com> 
	<aea82d2c0911230711n3da2308di9b4ece9479934b65@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911230748t3c2b9b4aj5f21d769e5344708@mail.gmail.com>

Thats something which is uniform for everybody,




On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Susane McKinney <mcksuzz at googlemail.com>wrote:

>
>>
>>
>
> People should be spiritual and not only 'be' but specially take it
> seriously and honestly - that's a difficulty even for the most real and
> genuin "balkanese".
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/914c1fd6/attachment.htm>

From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Mon Nov 23 17:02:01 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 17:02:01 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <5af37bb0911230748t3c2b9b4aj5f21d769e5344708@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
	<B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911230711n3da2308di9b4ece9479934b65@mail.gmail.com>
	<5af37bb0911230748t3c2b9b4aj5f21d769e5344708@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911230802y6b679171k5d8ae81a4d47358e@mail.gmail.com>

:

>
> Thats something which is uniform for everybody,
>
> Do you think it is so uniformly obvious for all? After my late experiences
I must say I do desbelieve. People 'think' they are spiritual and honest,
but essentially it does not happen at the wished scale.
People pretend and convince themselves of terms and significances that they
don't really 'use' on a regular/often/cyclic basis. But they do label the
'self' on those practices, maybe based on the uniformity you talk of.




>  On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Susane McKinney <mcksuzz at googlemail.com>wrote:
>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> People should be spiritual and not only 'be' but specially take it
>> seriously and honestly - that's a difficulty even for the most real and
>> genuin "balkanese".
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/e0f55bc5/attachment-0001.htm>

From yasir.media at gmail.com  Mon Nov 23 18:12:19 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 22:12:19 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911230802y6b679171k5d8ae81a4d47358e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc> 
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com> 
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com> 
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
	<B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com> 
	<aea82d2c0911230711n3da2308di9b4ece9479934b65@mail.gmail.com> 
	<5af37bb0911230748t3c2b9b4aj5f21d769e5344708@mail.gmail.com> 
	<aea82d2c0911230802y6b679171k5d8ae81a4d47358e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911230912k524d9529jacfa06d0cae08eb8@mail.gmail.com>

I dont mean it is the same for everyone.
I just meant that the difficulty applies to everyone.
and then its different for everybody.



On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 9:02 PM, Susane McKinney <mcksuzz at googlemail.com>wrote:

>
>
> :
>
>
>> Thats something which is uniform for everybody,
>>
>> Do you think it is so uniformly obvious for all? After my late experiences
> I must say I do desbelieve. People 'think' they are spiritual and honest,
> but essentially it does not happen at the wished scale.
> People pretend and convince themselves of terms and significances that they
> don't really 'use' on a regular/often/cyclic basis. But they do label the
> 'self' on those practices, maybe based on the uniformity you talk of.
>
>
>
>
>>  On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Susane McKinney <mcksuzz at googlemail.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> People should be spiritual and not only 'be' but specially take it
>>> seriously and honestly - that's a difficulty even for the most real and
>>> genuin "balkanese".
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Syndicate mailing list
>>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/ef4f5483/attachment.htm>

From worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 23 18:46:24 2009
From: worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com (jeff harrison)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 09:46:24 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Syndicate] =?utf-8?q?The_Shield_of_Archilochus=E2=80=8F?=
Message-ID: <228407.48309.qm@web52408.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

do these bones float, Ares?
?
encased in heroes
in cowards cased also
they, these bones, float
?
along with (who
was its new
bearer?) Archilochus' shield
?
and something, Ares, about the Milky Way



      
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091123/790e3e87/attachment.htm>

From aart at eunet.rs  Mon Nov 23 20:39:25 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 20:39:25 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc><5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com><5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc><B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911230710o5563168bh67e058282219824a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <961A1CE41DFD42E7AC7685DC396F546C@desktoppc>




>i agree with that. as long as it doesn't translate into 
>closed-mindedness...

Religion is about love and compassion. Helping others, what 
closed-mindnessness are you talking about.

> but your government hasn't taken a religous mantle yet. its probably
> secular.

Yes they are mostly very secular yapies. Satanists in most cases.

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_7ZgeBVo7w

That is an old Macedonian song. What is the point? Where are you originating 
from. I see you are traveling allot in Balkans, and former USSR, are you 
some ngo "researcher" or what?
Andrej 


From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Tue Nov 24 00:07:37 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 01:07:37 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
	<10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 23, 2009, at 5:27 PM, Susane McKinney wrote:


> Again (because I am stubborn) - the whole world was already  
> conquered and I believe still it has very less to do with the Balkans.
>
>


Where did you say you get your queens english from +?



> Besides the Balkans (not including rich european countries) have you  
> ever been to other countries in Europe? Have you been there on  
> holiday or have you experienced real life on those countries?
>


Queens English.




> So you come from the Balkans... where, if I may ask?


Queens English.















From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Tue Nov 24 10:59:33 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 10:59:33 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <961A1CE41DFD42E7AC7685DC396F546C@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
	<B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911230710o5563168bh67e058282219824a@mail.gmail.com>
	<961A1CE41DFD42E7AC7685DC396F546C@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911240159t6a19bda2x274a5aa8ee4deb3f@mail.gmail.com>

> i agree with that. as long as it doesn't translate into
>> closed-mindedness...
>>
>
> Religion is about love and compassion.


Perhaps, but take a look on what religion did to this world, or maybe i
should say what men made of religion.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091124/7a122100/attachment.htm>

From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Tue Nov 24 11:07:26 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 11:07:26 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
	<10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com>

>
>
>
>
> Where did you say you get your queens english from +?


I didn't, but I can do: my mother was irish, but she died before we could
speak. I learned in a English Institute in Madrid. My father is spanish, so
am I.


I didn't want to annoy you, but I am working with problematic young people,
on a social-integration basis. A friend of mine told me about this list. She
is an artist and was telling that you guys sometimes have particularly
interesting politic arguments here, that's why I gave it a try. The thing
is I can no longer cope with this "Balkans" bulls***t that is everywhere
- very unfairly.
If I said anything that upsets your inner feelings, I apologise. If you want
to make an attempt to understand what I meant with my previous posts, very
well.

Sorry for my english, but spanish natives are not very talented for
languages.

Saludos.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091124/439afbef/attachment.htm>

From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Tue Nov 24 11:46:19 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 12:46:19 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911240159t6a19bda2x274a5aa8ee4deb3f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220438u28d6a846x8a331b640967becc@mail.gmail.com>
	<8C6D2D251C8441A9BEBCD4779D8D1590@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
	<B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911230710o5563168bh67e058282219824a@mail.gmail.com>
	<961A1CE41DFD42E7AC7685DC396F546C@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240159t6a19bda2x274a5aa8ee4deb3f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <63AC001E-E9C1-4970-BFA4-571336BD4131@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 24, 2009, at 11:59 AM, Susane McKinney wrote:

> i agree with that. as long as it doesn't translate into closed- 
> mindedness...
>
> Religion is about love and compassion.
>
> Perhaps, but take a look on what religion did to this world, or  
> maybe i should say what men made of religion.


Yes, but look what they made of democracy.

And look what women have made of men.



From aart at eunet.rs  Tue Nov 24 12:08:35 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 12:08:35 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com><22E95DFC57ED4BD1872E7FB7254FA162@desktoppc><5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com><aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com><097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com><10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com><EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>


> I didn't want to annoy you, but I am working with problematic young 
> people,
> on a social-integration basis. A friend of mine told me about this list. 
> She
> is an artist and was telling that you guys sometimes have particularly
> interesting politic arguments here, that's why I gave it a try.


Welcome to this list Susane. Yes we have some interesting political 
arguments sometimes, but we were sometimes almost (or some really) evicted 
from this list for those interesting things. Hope it will not happen now 
again.


 >The thing
> is I can no longer cope with this "Balkans" bulls***t that is everywhere
> - very unfairly.

I am also sick of treating Balkans in some fashioned curated shows, 
biennales and other one-sided narrow views that took place in last decade, 
in the way that it suits to the West and its curators-propagandists. Balkan 
is not at all just dark, hatred, violence. I was traveling around the world 
but I found nowhere so much human warmness, compassion, hospitality and 
openness as in Balkans. They paint Balkans in dark colors in order to 
justify their genocidal actions toward us.

> Perhaps, but take a look on what religion did to this world, or maybe i
> should say what men made of religion.
>

I was talking about religion as way of life and thinking, not about church 
and its policy, because one can be religious without going to church, or a 
mosque or synagogue.

Andrej 


From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Tue Nov 24 12:37:33 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 12:37:33 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <63AC001E-E9C1-4970-BFA4-571336BD4131@ggttctttat.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
	<B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911230710o5563168bh67e058282219824a@mail.gmail.com>
	<961A1CE41DFD42E7AC7685DC396F546C@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240159t6a19bda2x274a5aa8ee4deb3f@mail.gmail.com>
	<63AC001E-E9C1-4970-BFA4-571336BD4131@ggttctttat.com>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911240337o5c01dcf0x63a920391d610c59@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:46 AM, | f | | | 3 <n2o at ggttctttat.com> wrote:

>
> On Nov 24, 2009, at 11:59 AM, Susane McKinney wrote:
>
> i agree with that. as long as it doesn't translate into
>> closed-mindedness...
>>
>> Religion is about love and compassion.
>>
>> Perhaps, but take a look on what religion did to this world, or maybe i
>> should say what men made of religion.
>>
>
>
> Yes, but look what they made of democracy.
>


There is not too much difference, like there is not too much difference from
what they've made of communism.

 Love and compassion are also part of spirituality, not exclusive to
religion, and above all, part of men (and women). In fact is the only
interesting part.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091124/85c02730/attachment.htm>

From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Tue Nov 24 12:45:42 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 12:45:42 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
	<10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com>
	<0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 12:08 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:

>
> I didn't want to annoy you, but I am working with problematic young people,
>> on a social-integration basis. A friend of mine told me about this list.
>> She
>> is an artist and was telling that you guys sometimes have particularly
>> interesting politic arguments here, that's why I gave it a try.
>>
>
>
> Welcome to this list Susane. Yes we have some interesting political
> arguments sometimes, but we were sometimes almost (or some really) evicted
> from this list for those interesting things. Hope it will not happen now
> again.


Thank you for the warmth. I hope you continue with what you are doing here.
I am new and only this discussion was interesting for me so far.





>
> >The thing
>
>> is I can no longer cope with this "Balkans" bulls***t that is everywhere
>> - very unfairly.
>>
>
> I am also sick of treating Balkans in some fashioned curated shows,
> biennales and other one-sided narrow views that took place in last decade,
> in the way that it suits to the West and its curators-propagandists. Balkan
> is not at all just dark, hatred, violence. I was traveling around the world
> but I found nowhere so much human warmness, compassion, hospitality and
> openness as in Balkans. They paint Balkans in dark colors in order to
> justify their genocidal actions toward us.
>
I have nothing against the Balkans, like I expressed before, my anger is
against the cool people (many come from the Balkans) who try to sell the
Balkans as if the Balkans were the origin of the world - we all know the
origin of the world are women!

Concerning warmness in the Balkans, no doubt there is a lot, but I don't see
it different from the warmth you get if you go to a village in Andaluzia or
in Greece or in France or in Russia or in Italy or in Portugalor in Iran or
in Bangladesh. My point is people - wherever you are, it is only about
people.




>
>  Perhaps, but take a look on what religion did to this world, or maybe i
>> should say what men made of religion.
>>
>>
> I was talking about religion as way of life and thinking, not about church
> and its policy, because one can be religious without going to church, or a
> mosque or synagogue.


Ok, I understand, but I would name it spirituality, though I believe in
religion also the way you are trying to express it.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091124/ec375a0e/attachment.htm>

From ctgr at free.fr  Tue Nov 24 14:10:46 2009
From: ctgr at free.fr (ctgr)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 14:10:46 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911240337o5c01dcf0x63a920391d610c59@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220547j2e3209b3odd0664edfd1f3028@mail.gmail.com>
	<7301D4CA-3758-4955-84BE-ABE4801AF8E9@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
	<B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911230710o5563168bh67e058282219824a@mail.gmail.com>
	<961A1CE41DFD42E7AC7685DC396F546C@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240159t6a19bda2x274a5aa8ee4deb3f@mail.gmail.com>
	<63AC001E-E9C1-4970-BFA4-571336BD4131@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911240337o5c01dcf0x63a920391d610c59@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <084743F5-584A-43AC-8A40-927115A8E84B@free.fr>


Le 24 nov. 09 ? 12:37, Susane McKinney a ?crit :

>
>
> On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:46 AM, | f | | | 3 <n2o at ggttctttat.com>  
> wrote:
>
> On Nov 24, 2009, at 11:59 AM, Susane McKinney wrote:
>
> i agree with that. as long as it doesn't translate into closed- 
> mindedness...
>
> Religion is about love and compassion.
>
> Perhaps, but take a look on what religion did to this world, or  
> maybe i should say what men made of religion.
>
>
> Yes, but look what they made of democracy.
>
>
> There is not too much difference, like there is not too much  
> difference from what they've made of communism.
>
>  Love and compassion are also part of spirituality, not exclusive to  
> religion, and above all, part of men (and women). In fact is the  
> only interesting part.
>

right


--
OG
-/ some may say : look what they made ov love and compassion .../-


>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091124/5b6db814/attachment.htm>

From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Tue Nov 24 15:55:18 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:55:18 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <084743F5-584A-43AC-8A40-927115A8E84B@free.fr>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911220802w3a5f19d1x2b6e9fa14bc13771@mail.gmail.com>
	<9D788FA4598A4BC3AE1C4D27CB49ABA5@desktoppc>
	<B0C801A1-59C4-41D6-8844-34333C461BF4@ggttctttat.com>
	<5af37bb0911230710o5563168bh67e058282219824a@mail.gmail.com>
	<961A1CE41DFD42E7AC7685DC396F546C@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240159t6a19bda2x274a5aa8ee4deb3f@mail.gmail.com>
	<63AC001E-E9C1-4970-BFA4-571336BD4131@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911240337o5c01dcf0x63a920391d610c59@mail.gmail.com>
	<084743F5-584A-43AC-8A40-927115A8E84B@free.fr>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911240655p59a71894uff64116ff51767cb@mail.gmail.com>

  OG
> -/ some may say : look what they made ov love and compassion .../-
>

They didn't... they just don't know how to handle IT, that's why God created
women - sometimes even women can not change that... but they try very
hard... and most of them have the courage not to give up.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091124/6c370793/attachment.htm>

From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Tue Nov 24 16:15:09 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:15:09 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
	<10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com>
	<0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F09D889C-8EB3-4F85-B182-A91ECBF78315@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 24, 2009, at 1:45 PM, Susane McKinney wrote:

>
> I have nothing against the Balkans, like I expressed before, my  
> anger is against the cool people

Tell us more about this fixation with cool Balkan people



> (many come from the Balkans) who try to sell the Balkans as if the  
> Balkans were the origin of the world - we all know the origin of the  
> world are women!


In the Balkans we leverage women all over the world as if they were  
the origin of the world



>
> Concerning warmness in the Balkans, no doubt there is a lot, but I  
> don't see it different from the warmth you get if you go to a  
> village in Andaluzia or in Greece or in France or in Russia or in  
> Italy or in Portugalor in Iran or in Bangladesh. My point is people  
> - wherever you are, it is only about people.


Mda, but people look different, talk different, smell different.


Warmth is not love.

















From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Tue Nov 24 16:49:49 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 16:49:49 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <F09D889C-8EB3-4F85-B182-A91ECBF78315@ggttctttat.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
	<10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com>
	<0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
	<F09D889C-8EB3-4F85-B182-A91ECBF78315@ggttctttat.com>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911240749x2c2fa8b7vd0d8e21c0deb3eff@mail.gmail.com>

>
>> I have nothing against the Balkans, like I expressed before, my anger is
>> against the cool people
>>
>
> Tell us more about this fixation with cool Balkan people


It is not my fixation. Was the moto of this discussion. I just express what
i see.


 (many come from the Balkans) who try to sell the Balkans as if the Balkans
>> were the origin of the world - we all know the origin of the world are
>> women!
>>
>
>
> In the Balkans we leverage women all over the world as if they were the
> origin of the world
>
>

How do you do it? Do you, yourself, agree with this leverage? How do you see
women, from the Balkans and not from the Balkans? I mean what do they
represent for you... A useful kind of warmth? Trust? Food? Reproduction? And
do you feel it different when you are with a Balkan woman or with any other
woman?
Too many questions, I know, but I'm taking a lot of this discussion.


>> Concerning warmness in the Balkans, no doubt there is a lot, but I don't
>> see it different from the warmth you get if you go to a village in Andaluzia
>> or in Greece or in France or in Russia or in Italy or in Portugalor in Iran
>> or in Bangladesh. My point is people - wherever you are, it is only about
>> people.
>>
>
>
> Mda, but people look different, talk different, smell different.
>
Cierto. Very right, but it doesn't mean people coming from the Balkans know
more about love or are more 'loving' or understand it better just because of
their geographical situation.
Like you mentioned "One can't reverse engineer childhood". The amount and
'quality' of love one gets as a child might signify salvation - this love
can be translated to "killing / growing what you eat".

I ask one of my youngsters (with whom I'm working) to draw a chicken.
Result: instead of a living chicken he draws a grilled chicken.



> Warmth is not love.


Love is not ignorance. It is a conscious commitment.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091124/5c84d087/attachment.htm>

From aart at eunet.rs  Tue Nov 24 18:23:57 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 18:23:57 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><5af37bb0911221137u3f5f49dax48dad04b2824e8a0@mail.gmail.com><aea82d2c0911221214y731624b7we96d0367ef5708c0@mail.gmail.com><097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com><10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com><EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com><0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>


> Thank you for the warmth. I hope you continue with what you are doing 
> here.
> I am new and only this discussion was interesting for me so far.

I like your approach to this discussion. I also didn't take part on the list 
for pretty long time, there were some technical problems I guess since we 
changed the server. By the way, where are you living in Spain. I visited it 
many times in last 15 years.


> I have nothing against the Balkans, like I expressed before, my anger is
> against the cool people (many come from the Balkans) who try to sell the
> Balkans as if the Balkans were the origin of the world - we all know the
> origin of the world are women!

Origin, who knows what is it? Maybe some outer civilization. Some 
intelligence is involved for sure.

>
> Concerning warmness in the Balkans, no doubt there is a lot, but I don't 
> see
> it different from the warmth you get if you go to a village in Andaluzia 
> or
> in Greece or in France or in Russia or in Italy or in Portugalor in Iran 
> or
> in Bangladesh. My point is people - wherever you are, it is only about
> people.

OK I like people too.

>
> Ok, I understand, but I would name it spirituality, though I believe in
> religion also the way you are trying to express it.

I am glad we aggree.
Andrej 


From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Wed Nov 25 12:12:27 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 12:12:27 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com>
	<10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com>
	<0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
	<F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com>

>
>
> I like your approach to this discussion. I also didn't take part on the
> list for pretty long time, there were some technical problems I guess since
> we changed the server. By the way, where are you living in Spain. I visited
> it many times in last 15 years.


I come from Sevilla. The land of strawberries.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091125/5580b826/attachment.htm>

From aart at eunet.rs  Wed Nov 25 17:52:29 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 17:52:29 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><097C678F-AF0F-49F7-AA8C-0D8C1820AE3E@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911221518p3b75aee5vd00cfa137c965eac@mail.gmail.com><10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com><EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com><0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com><F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>


> I come from Sevilla. The land of strawberries.
>
Thanks, I was not there. I was st seaside and islands.

Andrej


From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Wed Nov 25 19:52:27 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 18:52:27 +0000
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com>
	<0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
	<F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com>
	<B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com>

>  I come from Sevilla. The land of strawberries.
>>
>>  Thanks, I was not there. I was st seaside and islands.


You were in Palma, Mallorca? Known for being german tourists excellence
destination. You should try the Atlantic, the water is colder but the energy
is incredibly bigger.

Where did everybody go? Have I said something wrong?
Could any of you guys indicate good references - books, papers, internet -
for european politics? Can be about the Balkans :-) .

Thank you, saludos.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091125/6bc37c76/attachment.htm>

From aart at eunet.rs  Thu Nov 26 01:46:16 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 2009 01:46:16 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><10E92C3E-74AF-4100-8A49-CBCB13D3DFCD@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911230727k53094e71web35a9d0d5bc2f6c@mail.gmail.com><EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com><0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com><F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com><B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc>

> You were in Palma, Mallorca? Known for being german tourists excellence
> destination.

I was at Mallorca and Ibiza, also Tenerife, visited Barcelona.

You should try the Atlantic, the water is colder but the energy
> is incredibly bigger.

At Tenerife there were big waves, very strong.

> Where did everybody go? Have I said something wrong?

I also wonder where are they all. Maybe discussing only on weekends ;)

> Could any of you guys indicate good references - books, papers, internet -
> for european politics? Can be about the Balkans :-) .


For politics I got some American sites, very critical, but they are treating 
also Europe and rest of the world.

Try this
http://www.antiwar.com/
http://www.infowars.com/

Andrej


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
> 


From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Thu Nov 26 11:21:07 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 2009 11:21:07 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com>
	<aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com>
	<0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
	<F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com>
	<B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com>
	<18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com>

 You should try the Atlantic, the water is colder but the energy
>
>> is incredibly bigger.
>>
>
> At Tenerife there were big waves, very strong.
>
Yes, very well known for the excellent Windsurf conditions. A bit touristic,
I would say. Barcelona is a very beautiful city. El bario gotico has some
energy... some feeling... the whole topography of the city is something
already incredible.


>  Where did everybody go? Have I said something wrong?
>>
>
> I also wonder where are they all. Maybe discussing only on weekends ;)
>
:-)  My weekends are very fulfilled... but I will catch you guys later ;-)



>
>  Could any of you guys indicate good references - books, papers, internet
>> -
>> for european politics? Can be about the Balkans :-) .
>>
>
>
> For politics I got some American sites, very critical, but they are
> treating also Europe and rest of the world.
>
> Try this
> http://www.antiwar.com/
> http://www.infowars.com/


Americans can be 8 or 80. It is funny, isn't it? Thank you Andrej, very
interesting, a bit of "conspiracy" like, but interesting. Do you have
something that is more like an essay?

Thank you again, saludos.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091126/014dc178/attachment-0001.htm>

From aart at eunet.rs  Thu Nov 26 19:14:55 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 2009 19:14:55 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><EA57AA8F-30B0-4550-AB7F-2BC2207EEAF3@ggttctttat.com><aea82d2c0911240207g6f904047m896ba773cc6ca739@mail.gmail.com><0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com><F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com><B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com><18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc>

>  Thank you Andrej, very
> interesting, a bit of "conspiracy" like, but interesting. Do you have
> something that is more like an essay?

"Emperor's New Clothes" online magazine
http://globalresistance.com/index.html

Here you have good political essays, studies. You can list articles by 
authors from home page. I recommend Michel Chossudovsky, Blagovesta 
Doncheva, Jared Israel, Diane Johnstone (on Balkans). You can also list by 
title. Articles are old by still important.

Stratfor is also a good analytical site with a mailing list
http://www.stratfor.com/tour/

Also "StopNATO" Yahoo group archives with many articles up to most recent
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/stopnato/

Best,
Andrej 


From yasir.media at gmail.com  Fri Nov 27 00:45:39 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2009 04:45:39 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc> 
	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com> 
	<F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com> 
	<B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com> 
	<18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com> 
	<C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911261545r670c942as3e2284253bd79a36@mail.gmail.com>

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8381490.stm
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091127/876de8e7/attachment.htm>

From mcksuzz at googlemail.com  Mon Nov 30 13:07:08 2009
From: mcksuzz at googlemail.com (Susane McKinney)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:07:08 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
	<F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com>
	<B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com>
	<18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com>
	<C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <aea82d2c0911300407g3c097f9bp72ba79148186abad@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Andrej,

thanks a lot for all the links. I didn't have the chance to check them all,
but the ones I did, are exactly what I was looking for. I'll take a deeper
look and will be back to discuss with you.

Thank you very much indeed!!!

Saludos.

On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 7:14 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:

>   Thank you Andrej, very
>> interesting, a bit of "conspiracy" like, but interesting. Do you have
>> something that is more like an essay?
>>
>
> "Emperor's New Clothes" online magazine
> http://globalresistance.com/index.html
>
> Here you have good political essays, studies. You can list articles by
> authors from home page. I recommend Michel Chossudovsky, Blagovesta
> Doncheva, Jared Israel, Diane Johnstone (on Balkans). You can also list by
> title. Articles are old by still important.
>
> Stratfor is also a good analytical site with a mailing list
> http://www.stratfor.com/tour/
>
> Also "StopNATO" Yahoo group archives with many articles up to most recent
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/stopnato/
>
> Best,
>
> Andrej
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091130/1d056334/attachment.htm>

From info at furtherfield.org  Mon Nov 30 13:10:02 2009
From: info at furtherfield.org (info)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 12:10:02 +0000
Subject: [Syndicate] State of Art - A Conversation with G.H. Hovagimyan.
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911300407g3c097f9bp72ba79148186abad@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>	<0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc>	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>	<F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>	<aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com>	<B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>	<aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com>	<18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc>	<aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com>	<C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911300407g3c097f9bp72ba79148186abad@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4B13B61A.2050304@furtherfield.org>

Sorry for any cross posting...

State of Art - A Conversation with G.H. Hovagimyan.

A conversation between G.H. Hovagimyan and Mark Cooley conducted through 
electronic mail.
http://www.furtherfield.org/display_user.php?ID=906

Hovagimyan with Cooley about his experiences around censorship in art 
culture, identifying some of the taboos which tend to influence 
responses from potential censors (curators, board members, sponsors, 
politicians, and other interested parties). As well as the economics, 
funding and criterias around art practice, and how that shapes the 
context of how art is seen and presented in an art framework and what 
this means.

G.H. Hovagimyan is an experimental digital artist working in a variety 
of forms. He was one of the first artists in New York to start working 
with the Internet in the early nineties. His work ranges from hypertext 
works to digital performance art and installations. His streamed video 
talk shows, Art Dirt and Collider explore and document the artists of 
the digital art scene at the time circa 1995-2000.




---------------->

Other Info:

A living, breathing, thriving networked neighbourhood...

We are on Twitter
http://twitter.com/furtherfield

Other reviews/articles/interviews
http://www.furtherfield.org/reviews.php

Furtherfield - online media arts community, platforms for creating,
viewing, discussing and learning about experimental practices at the
intersections of art, technology and social change.
http://www.furtherfield.org

HTTP Gallery - physical media arts Gallery (London).
http://www.http.uk.net

Netbehaviour - an open email list community engaged in the process of
sharing and actively evolving critical approaches, methods and ideas
focused around contemporary networked media arts practice.
http://www.netbehaviour.org

Furtherfield Blog - shared space for personal reflections on media art
practice.
http://blog.furtherfield.org

VisitorsStudio - real-time, multi-user, online arena for creative 'many
to many' dialogue, networked performance and collaborative polemic.
http://www.visitorsstudio.org/x.html

Furthernoise -  an online platform for the creation, promotion,
criticism and archiving of innovative cross genre music and sound art
for the information & interaction of the public and artists alike.
http://www.furthernoise.org


From yasir.media at gmail.com  Mon Nov 30 14:18:30 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 18:18:30 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <aea82d2c0911300407g3c097f9bp72ba79148186abad@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com> 
	<F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com> 
	<B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com> 
	<18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com> 
	<C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911300407g3c097f9bp72ba79148186abad@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911300518q2a804b5bwc8b798426c0780fe@mail.gmail.com>

Dear Andrej,

Are you a supporter of Milosevic, Mladic & Karadic.
And can you say something about the massacres that made world
headlines a few yaers ago, and the mass graves that kept turning up.

Because is it not true that the massacres happened under their watch
and probably on their explicit orders or tacit okays ?

best


On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 5:07 PM, Susane McKinney <mcksuzz at googlemail.com> wrote:
> Hello Andrej,
>
> thanks a lot for all the links. I didn't have the chance to check them all,
> but the ones I did, are exactly what I was looking for. I'll take a deeper
> look and will be back to discuss with you.
>
> Thank you very much indeed!!!
>
> Saludos.
>
> On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 7:14 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
>>>
>>> ?Thank you Andrej, very
>>> interesting, a bit of "conspiracy" like, but interesting. Do you have
>>> something that is more like an essay?
>>
>> "Emperor's New Clothes" online magazine
>> http://globalresistance.com/index.html
>>
>> Here you have good political essays, studies. You can list articles by
>> authors from home page. I recommend Michel Chossudovsky, Blagovesta
>> Doncheva, Jared Israel, Diane Johnstone (on Balkans). You can also list by
>> title. Articles are old by still important.
>>
>> Stratfor is also a good analytical site with a mailing list
>> http://www.stratfor.com/tour/
>>
>> Also "StopNATO" Yahoo group archives with many articles up to most recent
>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/stopnato/
>>
>> Best,
>> Andrej
>> _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
>

From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Mon Nov 30 15:30:28 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 16:30:28 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <5af37bb0911300518q2a804b5bwc8b798426c0780fe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
	<F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com>
	<B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com>
	<18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com>
	<C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911300407g3c097f9bp72ba79148186abad@mail.gmail.com>
	<5af37bb0911300518q2a804b5bwc8b798426c0780fe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CEE5C464-082C-4D1B-95B1-F25A0C69A728@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 30, 2009, at 3:18 PM, yasir ~???? ???? wrote:


> Are you a supporter of Milosevic, Mladic & Karadic.
> And can you say something about the massacres that made world
> headlines a few yaers ago,



Eg. the criminal bombing of Yugoslavia by schizophrenic 'modern'  
occident 'democracies'
whose idea of union + multiculturalism is the systematic eradication  
of differences and
cultural nuances and geographical segregation along ethnic + religious  
+ socio-economic lines



























>
>
> best


From aart at eunet.rs  Mon Nov 30 15:56:00 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 15:56:00 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><0F0E94AE9FD24151A08F616D0B0C49E3@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com><F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com><B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com><18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com><C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911300407g3c097f9bp72ba79148186abad@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CD9D28CB809D45A5B8EAD11FC124F2AC@desktoppc>


Dear Susane,
I am glad you found links I sent interesting. I'll be glad to continue our 
discussion.
Best,
Andrej



> Hello Andrej,
>
> thanks a lot for all the links. I didn't have the chance to check them 
> all,
> but the ones I did, are exactly what I was looking for. I'll take a deeper
> look and will be back to discuss with you.
>
> Thank you very much indeed!!!
>
> Saludos.
>
> On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 7:14 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
>
>>   Thank you Andrej, very
>>> interesting, a bit of "conspiracy" like, but interesting. Do you have
>>> something that is more like an essay?
>>>
>>
>> "Emperor's New Clothes" online magazine
>> http://globalresistance.com/index.html
>>
>> Here you have good political essays, studies. You can list articles by
>> authors from home page. I recommend Michel Chossudovsky, Blagovesta
>> Doncheva, Jared Israel, Diane Johnstone (on Balkans). You can also list 
>> by
>> title. Articles are old by still important.
>>
>> Stratfor is also a good analytical site with a mailing list
>> http://www.stratfor.com/tour/
>>
>> Also "StopNATO" Yahoo group archives with many articles up to most recent
>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/stopnato/
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Andrej
>> _______________________________________________
>> Syndicate mailing list
>> Syndicate at ck13.org
>> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>>
>


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
> 


From aart at eunet.rs  Mon Nov 30 16:15:08 2009
From: aart at eunet.rs (Andrej Tisma)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 16:15:08 +0100
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
	<F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com>
	<B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com>
	<18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com>
	<C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911300407g3c097f9bp72ba79148186abad@mail.gmail.com>
	<5af37bb0911300518q2a804b5bwc8b798426c0780fe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F7AA05BC855645F2AB888AFC0013FDBD@desktoppc>

> Are you a supporter of Milosevic, Mladic & Karadic.

Dear Yasir,
Thanks for asking me this, because that is a typical question from a person 
getting information from one source only. First of all I want to tell you I 
never voted for Milosevic, although he was elected president of country I am 
living in. I can not stand communists. So I am not his direct supporter. But 
his trial in Hague was really a farce, he was kept in prison for years while 
prosecutors were trying to find some proof of his quilt. And they didn't 
find any, so he had to die in prison. About Mladic and Karadzic I really do 
not know, they were not prosecuted yet, and until they prove guilty they are 
innocent.

 > And can you say something about the massacres that made world
> headlines a few yaers ago, and the mass graves that kept turning up.

Have you read headlines about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, or Osama 
Bin Laden organizing 911 and hiding in Afghanistan? Did you ever believe 
that bulshit? Pity you.
If you are interested in real massacres in Kosovo, Bosnia and Croatia please 
take a look at my web art work made years ago "Check the Hague Prisoner" 
http://www.atisma.com/webart/Hague/tribunal.htm
Best,
Andrej


From n2o at ggttctttat.com  Mon Nov 30 16:30:32 2009
From: n2o at ggttctttat.com (| f | | | 3)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:30:32 +0200
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <F7AA05BC855645F2AB888AFC0013FDBD@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911240345x5385dfc5vd750e06c4f6a55aa@mail.gmail.com>
	<F3A656DF8E0344A383DBECF303C9ACC3@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com>
	<B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com>
	<18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com>
	<C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc><aea82d2c0911300407g3c097f9bp72ba79148186abad@mail.gmail.com>
	<5af37bb0911300518q2a804b5bwc8b798426c0780fe@mail.gmail.com>
	<F7AA05BC855645F2AB888AFC0013FDBD@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <4A232771-75EB-4D6E-9D6C-7C1D04E6B68C@ggttctttat.com>


On Nov 30, 2009, at 5:15 PM, Andrej Tisma wrote:

>> About Mladic and Karadzic I really do not know, they were not  
>> prosecuted yet, and until they prove guilty they are innocent.


The so called prosecutors haven't any authority to prosecute them
therefore they are and shall remain innocent irrespective of the
corrupt machinations of wig wearing occident puppets.



From worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 30 18:19:34 2009
From: worksonpaper03 at yahoo.com (jeff harrison)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 09:19:34 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Syndicate] =?utf-8?b?U2VwdGV04oCP?=
Message-ID: <760357.90766.qm@web52405.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

A rose of seven spears,
A cave of seven sleepers,
A galaxy of seven spheres,
A sphere of seven seas,
A scholar of seven sciences,
A singer of seven cities,
A lyre of seven strings am I.

?


      
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091130/2f43498f/attachment.htm>

From info at furtherfield.org  Mon Nov 30 18:45:51 2009
From: info at furtherfield.org (info)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:45:51 +0000
Subject: [Syndicate] Do It With Others (DIWO) at the Dark Mountain -
	Exhibition Opening
In-Reply-To: <1362893332.1771511257521897679.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
References: <1362893332.1771511257521897679.JavaMail.root@spooler9-g27.priv.proxad.net>
Message-ID: <4B1404CF.8070807@furtherfield.org>

Sorry for any cross posting...

Do It With Others (DIWO) at the Dark Mountain - Exhibition Opening

Press Release: December 2009

Do It With Others (DIWO)
at the Dark Mountain:
The Exhibition
http://http.uk.net

An exhibition resulting from a Mail-Art project across physical and 
digital networks, responding to the Dark Mountain Manifesto.

Private View: 7-9pm Full Moon, Wednesday 2nd December '09
Live performance at 8pm representing a central controversy
arising during the project

Gallery Open: 12-5pm, Friday-Sunday, 4th-12th December '09, 8th-30th 
January '10

We live in a time of social, economic and ecological unravelling. All 
around us are signs that our whole way of living is already passing into 
history. ? Uncivilisation, The Dark Mountain Manifesto.

The Dark Mountain Project is ?a new cultural movement for an age of 
global disruption.? It aims to ?question the stories that underpin our 
failing civilisation, to craft new ones for the age ahead and to write 
clearly and honestly about our true place in the world.? Do It With 
Others (DIWO) at the Dark Mountain, a mail-art project at HTTP Gallery, 
is a cultural collaboration for this age. ?Uncivilisation,? the Dark 
Mountain Manifesto, calls for a cultural response to our current 
predicament. Its challenge was offered to network-minded artists, 
technologists, writers and activists as a provocation ? to work together 
to re-envision the narratives and infrastructures that govern our 
relationships with the natural world, and how they might be unravelled 
and rewoven to reconfigure our place in it. As ?Uncivilisation? 
concludes, ?the end of the world as we know it is not the end of the 
world full stop.?

Artists, technologists, writers, activists and all other living beings 
were invited to correspond with each other across physical and digital 
mail networks, and the exhibition at HTTP present the results of this 
process. These have been gathered and the presentation devised during an 
Open Curation event, involving collaborators in real and virtual space. 
Transmissions to be shown in the exhibition include collaborative 
image-threads, net artworks, digital videos, drawings, paintings on wall 
and paper, sound works, and the full text of the discussion generated on 
the NetBehaviour list presented in numerous forms. The opening will also 
feature a performance representing a central controversy arising during 
the project. The exhibition offers new myths and maps for future 
uncivilisation at HTTP Gallery.

This is the second Do It With Others (DIWO) E-Mail-Art project initiated 
by Furtherfield.org. The first DIWO experiment in 2007 extended the 
Do-It-Yourself ethos of early net art, characterised by curiosity, 
activism and precision, towards a more collaborative approach, using the 
Internet as an experimental artistic medium and distribution system to 
foment grass-roots creativity.

Do It With Others at the Dark Mountain is a collaborative project by 
Furtherfield.org and The Dark Mountain Project.

More about The Dark Mountain Project and Furtherfield.org

The Dark Mountain Project is curated by Paul Kingsnorth and Dougald 
Hine. http://www.dark-mountain.net

Paul is the author of One No, Many Yeses and Real England. He was deputy 
editor of The Ecologist between 1999 and 2001. His first poetry 
collection, Kidland, is forthcoming from Salmon Poetry. 
http://www.paulkingsnorth.net

Dougald writes the blog ?Changing the World (and other excuses for not 
getting a proper job).? He is a former BBC journalist and co-founder of 
the School of Everything, and has written for and edited various online 
and offline magazines. http://www.dougald.co.uk

This project is part of Furtherfield.org's three-year Media Art 
Ecologies programme, which aims to provide opportunities for critical 
debate, exchange and participation in emerging ecological media art 
practices, and the theoretical, political and social contexts they 
engage. HTTP Gallery is Furtherfield.org?s dedicated space for media 
art. Furtherfield.org provides platforms for creating, viewing, 
discussing and learning about experimental practices in art and 
technology. Furtherfield.org and HTTP Gallery are supported by Arts 
Council England, London.

For details about the project, visit:
http://http.uk.net/diwodarkmountain

For more information contact:
Ale Scapin, HTTP Gallery
ale at furtherfield.org

HTTP Gallery
Unit A2, Arena Design Centre,
71 Ashfield Rd, London N4 1NY.
http://www.http.uk.net
http://www.furtherfield.org




From yasir.media at gmail.com  Mon Nov 30 20:31:02 2009
From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?eWFzaXIgftmK2Kcg2LPYsQ==?=)
Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 00:31:02 +0500
Subject: [Syndicate] NATO's Role In Erection Of Berlin Wall
In-Reply-To: <F7AA05BC855645F2AB888AFC0013FDBD@desktoppc>
References: <96D42196A34A47FEA0223E81F168790A@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911250312j6a2061e4rad99675ebb8d2f26@mail.gmail.com> 
	<B48848729A01465EA4C524AD2E82CB9E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911251052v5664c52p3788373cd3620b70@mail.gmail.com> 
	<18BDDDE707674C07AC0BD0E34EEDDE5E@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911260221p5ca738cfw97ad594c9469eb9c@mail.gmail.com> 
	<C47EC0DB46854B8D9A56A9EA106780C5@desktoppc>
	<aea82d2c0911300407g3c097f9bp72ba79148186abad@mail.gmail.com> 
	<5af37bb0911300518q2a804b5bwc8b798426c0780fe@mail.gmail.com> 
	<F7AA05BC855645F2AB888AFC0013FDBD@desktoppc>
Message-ID: <5af37bb0911301131w3419a8acmd32439f92bb79598@mail.gmail.com>

Interesting reply.

Have you read headlines about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, or Osama
Bin Laden organizing 911 and hiding in Afghanistan? Did you ever believe
that bulshit? Pity you.

whether i believe the headlines:

wmd: probably no
obl 911: maybe/probably       al-q: yes/pretty sure
obl in afgh: maybe/probably

pity - irrelevant, not applicable

I dont agree with the nato version. .. but europe should have acted first
and on its own.

still I would like to know who you think did this.
I am sure you have heard things_.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

in the website you are *countering official propaganda by nato, by showing
what the KLA had done in a different region, kosova  .. But you seem to be
saying that as tit-for-tat it was okay ?  one can see who was in a minority
and who was stronger in Srebrenica. it is the opposite in Kosovo and
Serbians. what happens in one cannot justify the other unless one thinks
there is a common enemy [?] nato, ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosova

mladic and karadic are not prosecuted, correct,  but which court will you
trust, whose decision are you prepared to accept?  do you think they should
be tried in Serbian or Bosnian courts ? do you think the connection between
them and the massacres is a false one, like framed charges.

I can understand the chaos. I know other places where this has happened, and
is happening.., and i know there always are definite individuals, people,
who are responsible, who plan these things, with support of people who have
power, who take advantage of the vacuum and by keeping normal protective
forces away.  and soon the reality becomes hard to remember, believe, accept
....

i am also curious, do you think the break up of yugoslavia was a good thing
?

best, thanks for writing,

y









On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 8:15 PM, Andrej Tisma <aart at eunet.rs> wrote:
>> Are you a supporter of Milosevic, Mladic & Karadic.
>
> Dear Yasir,
> Thanks for asking me this, because that is a typical question from a
person
> getting information from one source only. First of all I want to tell you
I
> never voted for Milosevic, although he was elected president of country I
am
> living in. I can not stand communists. So I am not his direct supporter.
But
> his trial in Hague was really a farce, he was kept in prison for years
while
> prosecutors were trying to find some proof of his quilt. And they didn't
> find any, so he had to die in prison. About Mladic and Karadzic I really
do
> not know, they were not prosecuted yet, and until they prove guilty they
are
> innocent.
>
>> And can you say something about the massacres that made world
>>
>> headlines a few yaers ago, and the mass graves that kept turning up.
>
> Have you read headlines about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, or
Osama
> Bin Laden organizing 911 and hiding in Afghanistan? Did you ever believe
> that bulshit? Pity you.
> If you are interested in real massacres in Kosovo, Bosnia and Croatia
please
> take a look at my web art work made years ago "Check the Hague Prisoner"
> http://www.atisma.com/webart/Hague/tribunal.htm
> Best,
> Andrej
>
> _______________________________________________
> Syndicate mailing list
> Syndicate at ck13.org
> https://ck13.org/mailman/listinfo/syndicate
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://ck13.org/pipermail/syndicate/attachments/20091201/e36ba31c/attachment.htm>

From n0name at gmx.de  Wed Nov 18 18:23:05 2009
From: n0name at gmx.de (n0name at gmx.de)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 17:23:05 -0000
Subject: [Syndicate] Peter Sloterdijk (38317)
Message-ID: <20091118172259.184860@gmx.net>

Peter Sloterdijk

(www.38317.tk)

http://www.n0name.de/38317/krach/peterslotedijk.mp3
http://www.n0name.de/38317/krach/petersloterdijk.txt

(c) 2009 n0name

-- 
Jetzt kostenlos herunterladen: Internet Explorer 8 und Mozilla Firefox 3.5 -
sicherer, schneller und einfacher! http://portal.gmx.net/de/go/chbrowser